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 Poisoned Tongue - What's the point?

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Soulless Samurai
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PostSubject: Re: Poisoned Tongue - What's the point?   Sat Apr 14 2018, 19:22

@Mppqlmd wrote:
I played Flayed Skull today, and I can say, i totally see the point with Poisoned Tongue :

The thing is, when i want to overthrow the game and deal as much raw damage as i can, here's what i do :

Disembark everything
Rapid fire
Charge

It puts the enemy in such a defensive position/mindset, if you do it at the right time you pretty much always win. You pretty much seize the initiative.


If you are into that strategy, Poisoned tongue is amazing, and i will probably play it from now on.

- You can disembark without losing your bonuses
- If you do so, you can reroll 1's to hit (archon) AND wound (PT)
- You keep your bonuses even when your transport is dead
- You have that extra bonus in CC (not a lot, but it helps)

Add the relic (that looks very appealing), and I think i'm playing Poisoned Tongue from now on.

Can I ask how you found Kabalites in combat?

Also, if you try a game with Poison Tongue, I'd love to hear your experience with them and how they compared to Flayed Skull.

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Mppqlmd
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PostSubject: Re: Poisoned Tongue - What's the point?   Sat Apr 14 2018, 19:46

Quote :
Can I ask how you found Kabalites in combat?

Aweful.

But if you add the splinter damage (with rerolls), the PGL, the CC, then the huge kick in the moral phase, it's REALLY godo when you factor in the price of our sweet Kabalites.

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Soulless Samurai
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PostSubject: Re: Poisoned Tongue - What's the point?   Sat Apr 14 2018, 21:03

@Mppqlmd wrote:

Aweful.

But if you add the splinter damage (with rerolls), the PGL, the CC, then the huge kick in the moral phase, it's REALLY godo when you factor in the price of our sweet Kabalites.

Interesting. When you go Poison Tongue, do you think you'll use Agonisers on them?

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Nogrim
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PostSubject: Re: Poisoned Tongue - What's the point?   Sat Apr 14 2018, 21:19

@Creeping Darkness wrote:
@FuelDrop wrote:

Alternative: 6-drop transports, 3 on each flank. whichever flank the enemy commits on, move to the other flank. if he commits on both, move your heavy hitters to the centre to be reinforced by deep strikes.

Another good option. There are lots of variations really (opponent likes to use scouts, rangers etc to aggressively camp territory? Leave a corner open then redeploy on top of them - no 9" restriction on deployment!). So Poison Tongue is the Kabal of Deployment Shenanigans, with bonus rerolls to wound on poison and melee Smile

Granted the stratagem doesn't scale particularly well, as you only ever get 3 units, so if you regularly play 3,000 point games it might not help you out as much as it otherwise might.


i think the important factor to that is it includes a transport and its payload. being able to redeploy 3x raiders full of troops or even just three ravagers is still a pretty big punch even in a 2k list.
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PostSubject: Re: Poisoned Tongue - What's the point?   Sun Apr 15 2018, 06:42

@Mppqlmd wrote:
I played Flayed Skull today, and I can say, i totally see the point with Poisoned Tongue :

The thing is, when i want to overthrow the game and deal as much raw damage as i can, here's what i do :

Disembark everything
Rapid fire
Charge

It puts the enemy in such a defensive position/mindset, if you do it at the right time you pretty much always win. You pretty much seize the initiative.


If you are into that strategy, Poisoned tongue is amazing, and i will probably play it from now on.

- You can disembark without losing your bonuses
- If you do so, you can reroll 1's to hit (archon) AND wound (PT)
- You keep your bonuses even when your transport is dead
- You have that extra bonus in CC (not a lot, but it helps)

Add the relic (that looks very appealing), and I think i'm playing Poisoned Tongue from now on.
Yeah, I’ve been wondering about the melee viability of Kabalites, especially starting on turn 3. Flayed Skull really depends on their transports, so I am starting to think they work best with 5-man Venom squad spam. Max out on transports and their survivability, and bob and weave at 18” until they are all dead. If you read their fluff desceiption, they consider touching alien ground an affront, so don’t embarrass them!
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Mppqlmd
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PostSubject: Re: Poisoned Tongue - What's the point?   Sun Apr 15 2018, 10:52

Quote :
If you read their fluff desceiption, they consider touching alien ground an affront, so don’t embarrass them!

They also like to hear the screams of their enemies from as close as possible. Let's say they avenge the affront by inflicting more pain.

A pirate raid that doesn't end up mano-a-mano is a bad pirate raid, imo ^^

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|Meavar
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PostSubject: Re: Poisoned Tongue - What's the point?   Sun Apr 15 2018, 14:08

@Soulless Samurai wrote:


Can I ask how you found Kabalites in combat?

With 10 kabalites including agonizer you kill 1.6 marines and 3.9 guard in melee after turn 3.
It is not much on it's own, but if you have a few units it does kill another squad a turn and who says no to that.
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PostSubject: Re: Poisoned Tongue - What's the point?   Sun Apr 15 2018, 14:23

It also adds to their shooting, and creates a pretty heavy Moral check for that unit.

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PostSubject: Re: Poisoned Tongue - What's the point?   Sun Apr 15 2018, 14:45

Lawrence is using poison tongue in a tactica, along with black heart and prophets.

They are doing alright, having the re rolls to hit and wound is actually getting a few wounds on the storm raven/storm talon

The real benefit is not having to keep everything within 6” of the muse and getting both re rolls

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PostSubject: Re: Poisoned Tongue - What's the point?   Sun Apr 15 2018, 16:09

The problem is he would have get almost the same result with Flayed skull. I dont see the point of tacking poisoned tongue oer flayed skull if you dont go on foot
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PostSubject: Re: Poisoned Tongue - What's the point?   Sun Apr 15 2018, 16:51

Almost the same, except he gets re roll 1s to hit and to wound as long as you walk your archon. Flayed skull doesnt get that even if you walk an archon.

disembark kabalites if you want even more firepower

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Dark Elf Dave
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PostSubject: Re: Poisoned Tongue - What's the point?   Mon Apr 16 2018, 09:45

I have watched the bat rep from Lawrence. He is a clever player that's for sure and I always learn something useful from his bat reps.

Lawrence is very good at finding ways to play to a codex strengths. A bit like someone trying to make a death star, finds a unit that compliments another unit and then spams those units.

In this batrep he basically spammed Talos and Venoms with x3 DC Ravagers for heavy support. Haemy buffed Talos which took a ton of fire to down while the Venoms got re-roll ones to hit from the Archon and re-roll 1's to wound from Poison Tongue. Venoms took care of Robo G after he killed 2 Talos in one round of combat.
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