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 Lelith or a Succubus? What does more work?

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Korazell
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Join date : 2013-03-08

PostSubject: Lelith or a Succubus? What does more work?   Sun Apr 08 2018, 23:28


So, I was list building with the new codex and I love it, I got my Talos who can do stupid work, got my wyches who do well, got my kabal, got the options of using allied in Wraightknight, I got all these new toys and then I ran into my biggest complaint...

Lelith can't be any other cult besides Strife. And strife, to me, has the weakest benefit. I'll take the +1 strength over situational attacks, anyday of the week, and then try and give them the drugs that benefit them. I firmly believe that we should be able to pick our drugs for all units and not randomly roll that stuff, but, I don't write the rules.

Which leads me to an issue...

While I love Lelith's rules is she actually worth taking a patrol of strife for my main melee force? I want to use the strat with a tantalus and really just spend 3 points to double-pop armor or a unit but at the same time I don't think it's worth the sacrifice to my wyches. That stupid Glaive not allowing me to use blood dancer sucks.

So, what do you think? Is Lelith worth it? Or can a succubus with some other set up do just as well?

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" Your suffering will be legendary. It will make the dead, long forgotten in our dear Commorragh, rattle in their graves as your agony touches them even from the beyond. I will record each scream, each gurgle, each cry and it will be my sweetest lullaby. The tears you spill will be collected and I will savor them like fine drink for years to come. The blood you spill will be used to feed my house-plants, and your flesh I will feed to the Razorwing flocks. Your bones I will keep and fashion into my clothes like a medal awarded for reaching the highest plateau of torture. You will never steal my sandwych again!"
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lament.config
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PostSubject: Re: Lelith or a Succubus? What does more work?   Mon Apr 09 2018, 00:24

With her drop in points I think she is worth considering. The cult of strife shouldn't be underestimated either since I belive +1 attack maths out to be better than +1 strength.

But, I'll probably be bringing a succubus with the red glaive and a 3++ more often.
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mynamelegend
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PostSubject: Re: Lelith or a Succubus? What does more work?   Mon Apr 09 2018, 00:43

If you want Cult of Strife, bring a Succubus with the Triptych Whip and Blood Dancer warlord trait and you'll be looking at "low teens" of agoniser hits each turn. Tripwhip does way more with Blood Dancer than poor little Lelith ever could.

If you're not into Strife, Cursed Blade probably has the weakest Succubus of the three. Take her with the Traitor's Embrace and a Shardnet and suicide-cuddle something while you focus on the rest of your cult force, or just take her plain and put her wherever your other HQs go.

Red Grief gets amazing use out of their Reavers, and the Bloodcubus (Blood Glaive + Hyper-swift Reflexes) is a legit good little 50 point beatstick. So, probably the best Succubus setup aside from Strife's Whip Dancer.

Either way I'm not convinced Lelith actually brings that much to the table if you're looking for a Patrol or Spearhead, but she is a good second HQ for a Battalion so you don't need to spend more drugs or relics on your HQs. Overall? Aim for the Succ first, and maybe the Footsies later.
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withershadow
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PostSubject: Re: Lelith or a Succubus? What does more work?   Mon Apr 09 2018, 00:45

The extra attack isn’t that situational. You’re almost always charging or being charged. There is even a stratagem that lets your regular units fall back and still charge that turn.
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Dalakh
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PostSubject: Re: Lelith or a Succubus? What does more work?   Mon Apr 09 2018, 08:06

If you're gonna take a kitted out Red Grief Succubus i'd really consider giving her a blast pistol. With that and +S drug she can pretty reliably kill a vehicle in one turn or two depending on your rolls.
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Korazell
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PostSubject: Re: Lelith or a Succubus? What does more work?   Mon Apr 09 2018, 09:16

Hmm....Triptech succubus gets on average 15 attacks with charge, 1+ attack drug, and then triptech and 3 5-6 after turn 3, which after getting space marine saves, is about 5ish damage over-all.  If I did my math right and I am always iffy about math.

Mathmatically, yeah, cursed blade has good wyches because they can get the +1 str and get the attack, but, I think it's still better to get the extra attacks...not sure...but the succubus is eh.

Red Grief actually...kinda shocked me. I viewed it as my "Get things in face turn 1, Reavers ride again+Hellions" angle...but...I think I can do some sick things with it.  First off, their succubus can basically be a mini lelith with the +1 invulnerable, plus, with blaster and the glaive it's a mean-ish 7-9 wounds...plus re-roll charge AND when I unpack my wyches from my fun party bus of a tantalus and murder something, I can then get back in for some CP and do it all over again if I wanted to...

Huh, I guess I wasn't really looking at it too critically. Thanks guys, that helped!

_________________
" Your suffering will be legendary. It will make the dead, long forgotten in our dear Commorragh, rattle in their graves as your agony touches them even from the beyond. I will record each scream, each gurgle, each cry and it will be my sweetest lullaby. The tears you spill will be collected and I will savor them like fine drink for years to come. The blood you spill will be used to feed my house-plants, and your flesh I will feed to the Razorwing flocks. Your bones I will keep and fashion into my clothes like a medal awarded for reaching the highest plateau of torture. You will never steal my sandwych again!"
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