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 3 Patrols might not be best

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withershadow
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PostSubject: Re: 3 Patrols might not be best   Wed Apr 04 2018, 18:09

@Soulless Samurai wrote:

With the Court apparently being slotless now, does Kabal even have any Elite or Fast Attack units of its own?
Has this changed from the Index? Because you could take them as regular elite choices.
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Lord Asvaldir
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PostSubject: Re: 3 Patrols might not be best   Wed Apr 04 2018, 18:24

It has changed form the index, you now can only take court models if you have an archon, and I believe the court models don't actually take up a slot.

Honestly not really a big deal, if you really need to fill elite slots mandrakes are awesome and incubi aren't bad either.

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withershadow
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PostSubject: Re: 3 Patrols might not be best   Wed Apr 04 2018, 18:30

@Lord Asvaldir wrote:
It has changed form the index, you now can only take court models if you have an archon, and I believe the court models don't actually take up a slot.

Honestly not really a big deal, if you really need to fill elite slots mandrakes are awesome and incubi aren't bad either.
It just means I can't take a unit of 10 Sslyth because I don't have enough Archons. Very Happy
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Lord Asvaldir
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PostSubject: Re: 3 Patrols might not be best   Wed Apr 04 2018, 18:34

Right because we all want to use a unit of 10 ssylths in our average list..

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PostSubject: Re: 3 Patrols might not be best   Wed Apr 04 2018, 18:51

Quote :
Reese is acting like the detachment restriction is coming down from GW and not from them, so he seems to be washing his hands of the situation.

That sounds like Reese. FLG is basically the second GW community site at this point so expecting him to buck anything GW expects or wants in their game is too much. Credit where it's due Mike Brandt isn't afraid to tell Games Workshop when they're asking too much and still runs a real slick tournament IMO better than the ITC rules.

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PostSubject: Re: 3 Patrols might not be best   Wed Apr 04 2018, 18:57

Totally random, but out of curiosity:
What are the chances that command auras get FAQ'd that it can be used while inside transports?

And yes, Reece is a total GW shill. Any company or affiliate that has a monetary connection to GW's success is straight shillcity. Same could be said about Team Covenant and FFG.
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sethlight
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PostSubject: Re: 3 Patrols might not be best   Wed Apr 04 2018, 19:00

@HERO wrote:


Will it be good?  Probably not!  But who cares!

Call me a scrub, but that doesn't look like a bad list in the lest.  Disintegrators (for days) will rip apart strong troops, the wyches will take out anything light and Dark lances will take out what is heavy.

Personally, my meta would just require more dark lances.
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PostSubject: Re: 3 Patrols might not be best   Wed Apr 04 2018, 19:06

@HERO wrote:
Totally random, but out of curiosity:
What are the chances that command auras get FAQ'd that it can be used while inside transports?

I find it hard to believe that the playtesters didn't once bring up this issue.

Hence, I'm guessing the designers specifically didn't want our auras to work out of, inside, or into transports.
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PostSubject: Re: 3 Patrols might not be best   Wed Apr 04 2018, 19:50

@TheMortician wrote:
Obviously its more forced upon us than on others, but in the end its not much different from competitive builds in other armies. Most "pure" tournament IG lists take Cadian mortars/Catachan Basilisks/Tallarn tanks. Eldar take Aliatoc rangers/Samm Hain spears. CSM take Alpha Legion cultists and World Eater Beserkers. In practice its really not that different.
Actually, no, CSM take Alpha Legion Berserkers, so you can infiltrate a big mob of them and charge their whole army on turn 1. Twisted Evil

@Soulless Samurai wrote:
@HERO wrote:
Totally random, but out of curiosity:
What are the chances that command auras get FAQ'd that it can be used while inside transports?

I find it hard to believe that the playtesters didn't once bring up this issue.

Hence, I'm guessing the designers specifically didn't want our auras to work out of, inside, or into transports.
This is indeed unfortunate. I wouldn't ask for special snowflake status on transport auras beyond the fact that we have among the only "open topped" vehicles in the game, but it would have been nice if Gangs of Commorragh introduced "gang leaders" models for the hellions and reavers, so we had mounted HQ options again.  I pulled out the old Phil Kelly book the other day... I'd pay 15 points today for a Hellion board.

Ah well, c'est la vie.  We do have two Kabal factions that generate re-rolls while embarked (Poisoned Tongue and Flayed Skull), so they did compensate for this issue somewhat.

I do see this complaint a lot, though, are raiders actually surviving long enough that being embarked becomes an actual problem?  I am looking at my typical Guard list, and I should be able to kill half a dozen raiders no problem.  You are flying around in Scout Sentinels. Razz
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Lord Asvaldir
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PostSubject: Re: 3 Patrols might not be best   Wed Apr 04 2018, 21:24

@HERO wrote:
Totally random, but out of curiosity:
What are the chances that command auras get FAQ'd that it can be used while inside transports?

Hard to say what the chances are I think. No other army has auras that can work from inside transports to affect transported units, but pretty much every army except I think Orks doesn't really have open topped transports, so there isn't really a precedent. Could happen, which would be nice, could not which would be meh, but since I strongly suspect I'll be running flayed skull most of the time it doesn't make a big difference to me.

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PostSubject: Re: 3 Patrols might not be best   Wed Apr 04 2018, 23:37

If it happens, Flayed Skull will lose favor and Poisoned Tongue will rise Very Happy

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PostSubject: Re: 3 Patrols might not be best   Wed Apr 04 2018, 23:39

That is definetly true, the potential to reroll 1s to hit and wound while in transports would be nice. That being said without any actual playtesting I still think flayed skull is my favorite, thematically wise it's the exact way I want to play dark eldar.

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PostSubject: Re: 3 Patrols might not be best   Wed Apr 04 2018, 23:51

@Mppqlmd wrote:
If it happens, Flayed Skull will lose favor and Poisoned Tongue will rise Very Happy

I know it's a terrible strategy, but I really want to use Poisoned Tongue just for the artefact.

I just like the idea of a sniper-Archon. Twisted Evil

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Lord Asvaldir
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PostSubject: Re: 3 Patrols might not be best   Wed Apr 04 2018, 23:53

Poisoned tongue isn't bad, the reroll helps with all of our splinter weapons. Yeah maybe flayed skull is better because it has more bonuses than just reroll 1s, but I don't think you'll be unhappy playing poisoned tongue if that's the way you want to go.

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PostSubject: Re: 3 Patrols might not be best   Thu Apr 05 2018, 01:04

@Lord Asvaldir wrote:
Poisoned tongue isn't bad, the reroll helps with all of our splinter weapons. Yeah maybe flayed skull is better because it has more bonuses than just reroll 1s, but I don't think you'll be unhappy playing poisoned tongue if that's the way you want to go.

Well, I'm thinking that if I want any Gunboats, I'll take a Flayed Skull detachment (for the splinter racks synergy). But if I'm just using small squads in Venoms or such, I'll go with Poison Tongue.

It might be good for Lhamaeans, too. I've heard rumours that they inflict Mortal Wounds on a 4+ in combat (against non-vehicles). Shocked

Out of interest, for an Archon with Soul Seeker, do you think there's any benefit to giving him his own Venom, or should I just run him on foot?

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Cerve
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PostSubject: Re: 3 Patrols might not be best   Thu Apr 05 2018, 01:13

@Soulless Samurai wrote:
@Lord Asvaldir wrote:
Poisoned tongue isn't bad, the reroll helps with all of our splinter weapons. Yeah maybe flayed skull is better because it has more bonuses than just reroll 1s, but I don't think you'll be unhappy playing poisoned tongue if that's the way you want to go.

Well, I'm thinking that if I want any Gunboats, I'll take a Flayed Skull detachment (for the splinter racks synergy). But if I'm just using small squads in Venoms or such, I'll go with Poison Tongue.

It might be good for Lhamaeans, too. I've heard rumours that they inflict Mortal Wounds on a 4+ in combat (against non-vehicles).  Shocked

Out of interest, for an Archon with Soul Seeker, do you think there's any benefit to giving him his own Venom, or should I just run him on foot?

Bring both. Fit Tongue Kabals inside Flayed Transports. So you will get rerolls on 1 bot to hit and wound
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PostSubject: Re: 3 Patrols might not be best   Thu Apr 05 2018, 01:37

@Cerve wrote:
@Soulless Samurai wrote:
@Lord Asvaldir wrote:
Poisoned tongue isn't bad, the reroll helps with all of our splinter weapons. Yeah maybe flayed skull is better because it has more bonuses than just reroll 1s, but I don't think you'll be unhappy playing poisoned tongue if that's the way you want to go.

Well, I'm thinking that if I want any Gunboats, I'll take a Flayed Skull detachment (for the splinter racks synergy). But if I'm just using small squads in Venoms or such, I'll go with Poison Tongue.

It might be good for Lhamaeans, too. I've heard rumours that they inflict Mortal Wounds on a 4+ in combat (against non-vehicles).  Shocked

Out of interest, for an Archon with Soul Seeker, do you think there's any benefit to giving him his own Venom, or should I just run him on foot?

Bring both. Fit Tongue Kabals inside Flayed Transports. So you will get rerolls on 1 bot to hit and wound

Negative red leader, that is not how it works. The transport does not grant the ability to the occupants, Flayed Skull units that are embarked on flying transports have the ability. This is still interesting, however, since Poisoned Tongue transports get nothing (well, Venoms get buffs to their splinter cannons, I guess). Even then I would prefer Red Grief Venoms for my Poison Tongue Archon+Court.


Last edited by withershadow on Thu Apr 05 2018, 01:42; edited 1 time in total
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PostSubject: Re: 3 Patrols might not be best   Thu Apr 05 2018, 01:41

@withershadow wrote:
@Cerve wrote:
@Soulless Samurai wrote:
@Lord Asvaldir wrote:
Poisoned tongue isn't bad, the reroll helps with all of our splinter weapons. Yeah maybe flayed skull is better because it has more bonuses than just reroll 1s, but I don't think you'll be unhappy playing poisoned tongue if that's the way you want to go.

Well, I'm thinking that if I want any Gunboats, I'll take a Flayed Skull detachment (for the splinter racks synergy). But if I'm just using small squads in Venoms or such, I'll go with Poison Tongue.

It might be good for Lhamaeans, too. I've heard rumours that they inflict Mortal Wounds on a 4+ in combat (against non-vehicles).  Shocked

Out of interest, for an Archon with Soul Seeker, do you think there's any benefit to giving him his own Venom, or should I just run him on foot?

Bring both. Fit Tongue Kabals inside Flayed Transports. So you will get rerolls on 1 bot to hit and wound

Negative red leader, that is not how it works. The transport does not grant the ability to the occupants, Flayed Skull units that are embarked on flying transports have the ability.

That's true, my misreading
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PostSubject: Re: 3 Patrols might not be best   Thu Apr 05 2018, 01:48

@withershadow wrote:
@Cerve wrote:
@Soulless Samurai wrote:
@Lord Asvaldir wrote:
Poisoned tongue isn't bad, the reroll helps with all of our splinter weapons. Yeah maybe flayed skull is better because it has more bonuses than just reroll 1s, but I don't think you'll be unhappy playing poisoned tongue if that's the way you want to go.

Well, I'm thinking that if I want any Gunboats, I'll take a Flayed Skull detachment (for the splinter racks synergy). But if I'm just using small squads in Venoms or such, I'll go with Poison Tongue.

It might be good for Lhamaeans, too. I've heard rumours that they inflict Mortal Wounds on a 4+ in combat (against non-vehicles).  Shocked

Out of interest, for an Archon with Soul Seeker, do you think there's any benefit to giving him his own Venom, or should I just run him on foot?

Bring both. Fit Tongue Kabals inside Flayed Transports. So you will get rerolls on 1 bot to hit and wound

Negative red leader, that is not how it works. The transport does not grant the ability to the occupants, Flayed Skull units that are embarked on flying transports have the ability.  This is still interesting, however, since Poisoned Tongue transports get nothing (well, Venoms get buffs to their splinter cannons, I guess).  Even then I would prefer Red Grief Venoms for my Poison Tongue Archon+Court.

Immediately synergies pop to mind:
Flayed Skull Raider for +3" faster Wych delivery
Black Heart Raider for 6+++

Perhaps the best is Obsidian Rose Infantry in Black Heart Raiders.  I can't see any conflicts or non-beneficial rules. You just get 24" Blasters while riding in 6+++ Raiders.
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PostSubject: Re: 3 Patrols might not be best   Thu Apr 05 2018, 01:57

@HERO wrote:
@withershadow wrote:
@Cerve wrote:
@Soulless Samurai wrote:
@Lord Asvaldir wrote:
Poisoned tongue isn't bad, the reroll helps with all of our splinter weapons. Yeah maybe flayed skull is better because it has more bonuses than just reroll 1s, but I don't think you'll be unhappy playing poisoned tongue if that's the way you want to go.

Well, I'm thinking that if I want any Gunboats, I'll take a Flayed Skull detachment (for the splinter racks synergy). But if I'm just using small squads in Venoms or such, I'll go with Poison Tongue.

It might be good for Lhamaeans, too. I've heard rumours that they inflict Mortal Wounds on a 4+ in combat (against non-vehicles).  Shocked

Out of interest, for an Archon with Soul Seeker, do you think there's any benefit to giving him his own Venom, or should I just run him on foot?

Bring both. Fit Tongue Kabals inside Flayed Transports. So you will get rerolls on 1 bot to hit and wound

Negative red leader, that is not how it works. The transport does not grant the ability to the occupants, Flayed Skull units that are embarked on flying transports have the ability.  This is still interesting, however, since Poisoned Tongue transports get nothing (well, Venoms get buffs to their splinter cannons, I guess).  Even then I would prefer Red Grief Venoms for my Poison Tongue Archon+Court.

Immediately synergies pop to mind:
Flayed Skull Raider for +3" faster Wych delivery
Black Heart Raider for 6+++

Perhaps the best is Obsidian Rose Infantry in Black Heart Raiders.  I can't see any conflicts or non-beneficial rules.  You just get 24" Blasters while riding in 6+++ Raiders

Can you technically start in that transport tho? I need to look at the rules a bit.

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PostSubject: Re: 3 Patrols might not be best   Thu Apr 05 2018, 02:01

@amishprn86 wrote:
@HERO wrote:
@withershadow wrote:
@Cerve wrote:
@Soulless Samurai wrote:
@Lord Asvaldir wrote:
Poisoned tongue isn't bad, the reroll helps with all of our splinter weapons. Yeah maybe flayed skull is better because it has more bonuses than just reroll 1s, but I don't think you'll be unhappy playing poisoned tongue if that's the way you want to go.

Well, I'm thinking that if I want any Gunboats, I'll take a Flayed Skull detachment (for the splinter racks synergy). But if I'm just using small squads in Venoms or such, I'll go with Poison Tongue.

It might be good for Lhamaeans, too. I've heard rumours that they inflict Mortal Wounds on a 4+ in combat (against non-vehicles).  Shocked

Out of interest, for an Archon with Soul Seeker, do you think there's any benefit to giving him his own Venom, or should I just run him on foot?

Bring both. Fit Tongue Kabals inside Flayed Transports. So you will get rerolls on 1 bot to hit and wound

Negative red leader, that is not how it works. The transport does not grant the ability to the occupants, Flayed Skull units that are embarked on flying transports have the ability.  This is still interesting, however, since Poisoned Tongue transports get nothing (well, Venoms get buffs to their splinter cannons, I guess).  Even then I would prefer Red Grief Venoms for my Poison Tongue Archon+Court.

Immediately synergies pop to mind:
Flayed Skull Raider for +3" faster Wych delivery
Black Heart Raider for 6+++

Perhaps the best is Obsidian Rose Infantry in Black Heart Raiders.  I can't see any conflicts or non-beneficial rules.  You just get 24" Blasters while riding in 6+++ Raiders

Can you technically start in that transport tho? I need to look at the rules a bit.

You can. There's no rule that says you cannot, as long as it's a valid transport type, you're free to ride in it.
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amishprn86
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PostSubject: Re: 3 Patrols might not be best   Thu Apr 05 2018, 02:03

Nvrm, idk what i was thinking, its late, OFC you can, otherwise HQ's cant join and multi-units cant.

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