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 Prophets of Flesh Ground Force

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ShamPow1999
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PostSubject: Prophets of Flesh Ground Force    Sun Apr 01 2018, 06:55

I hesitate to ask about this simply because I don't have access to the new codex and I am unsure if I am allowed to make a post like this, or if the information I've assumed to fact is correct, but here goes!

With Urien Rakarth going down considerably in points, I was considering running a small flavorful ground contingent of Prophets of Flesh. I'm hoping that it would be a feasible way to have a tough, hard hitting force to soak up fire while moving up the board to get into combat. After listening to BoL's video on Youtube (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g-9cjx1A2QI) , it seems that in addition to the point decrease, Urien gives +1 T to nearby coven units, in addition to +1S and +1Ld to Prophets of Flesh units. I also believe that there is a warlord trait that allows Coven units to re-roll 1s for their invulnerable saves (although I am unsure if Prophets of Flesh have access to this, or if the +1S and +1Ld bubble is a Warlord Trait in itself). In any case, this is what I'm thinking of:

Urien Rakarth
- Provides a +1 T, +1 S, +1 Ld bubble within 6"
- Re-roll 1s for invulnerable saves (the D3 command points might also be good depending on some of the other stratagems Covens have access too.)

I got this from BoLs video and I believe it was mentioned in latest Splinter Mind podcast.

5 Grotesques
- 6 S5 (possibly S6) AP-2 D1 attacks
- 20 T6 4++, 6+++ Wounds

I recall Grotesques costing 1 additional point, gaining 1 attack, -1AP, and 1 Wound. I can't recall where exactly I heard this so if someone could double check this, that would be great!

2 Talos Pain Engine
- 4 Haywire Blasters - 4D3 Haywire Shots
- 4 Macroscalpels - 12 S7 (possibly S8) AP-2 D2 attacks
- 14 T7 3+, 4++, 6+++ Wounds

I think for just under 500 points (493 pts) it would be survivable and also hit pretty hard. You would have to include a unit (or three Wink of Wracks to make it a Patrol Detachment. I imagine this working in conjunction with a Kabal Patrol Detachment or two to make up for lack of shooting and darklight. If anyone could verify the rules and points I've mentioned it would be greatly appreciated, as it would be really pointless otherwise. Not sure if i'm allowed to mention the points at all actually, considering they're all conjecture at this point I would think.

Do you think this could be seen on the tabletop? Apologies in advance if I rambled^, my head is still somewhat scrambled from all the Codex info. Really excited for this!

Edit:
I removed all the point values as I think it violated rules. Sorry about that.




Last edited by ShamPow1999 on Sun Apr 01 2018, 20:26; edited 1 time in total
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drynwyn
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PostSubject: Re: Prophets of Flesh Ground Force    Sun Apr 01 2018, 08:26

I would consider putting more points into large numbers of Wracks. Hordes are good in 8th edition, and Wracks are looking to make a surprisingly dangerous horde.

With the Haemy/Rakarth's +1 toughness bubble, for just a few points a base, you have squadrons of T5 bodies with a 4++ save and a 6+ FnP. To me, they look significantly better than Grots as ground-pounders.
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Crazy_Ivan
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PostSubject: Re: Prophets of Flesh Ground Force    Sun Apr 01 2018, 08:30

I could see that working, I plan to do what i used to do. 3 raiders packed with 2 units of grots 1 of wracks, with two haemes. Rush them turn 1 straight into enemy lines. They have to deal with them, it leaves the rest of my army free to do what it wants, with a 4++ on the vehicles They will be tough to get rid of.
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amishprn86
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PostSubject: Re: Prophets of Flesh Ground Force    Sun Apr 01 2018, 14:06

Yeah, Wracks seems to be really good as a 4++/FnP 9ppm guy lol

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ShamPow1999
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PostSubject: Re: Prophets of Flesh Ground Force    Sun Apr 01 2018, 14:46

It’s interesting that you mention using several large units of Wracks. I didn’t really consider that but it seems like there are both advantages and disadvantages to doing that.
20 Wracks with no upgrades - 180 pts
5 Grotesques - 205 pts
I think with upgrades on the Wrack unit, these two units would be similarly costed. That being said:
Pros:
- 20 Wounds distributed over 20 Models (better for multi-damage weapons)
- Better shooting (assuming you take Ossetactors or Liquifier Guns with your points)
- Larger footprint to better screen and disrupt
Cons:
- T5 instead of T6 (granted this would probably only matter against armies with lots of S5 or S3 shooting)
- More Attacks but no AP or ability to inflict MW in combat (the AP is a bigger deal since Ossetactors can do that anyway)
- Not as effective against small arms shooting as every wound will kill a model (1W vs 4W)

Now that I think about it the horde of wracks may be more competitive as screening units are definitely valuable, but I think Grotesques will attract multi-damage shooting whereas wracks will not, while also being slightly more effective after faking wounds from small arm fire. Not sure if the logic makes sense but perhaps the unit of 20 Wracks isn’t that much better? It may also depend on what strategems Coven has for Grotesques since I do recall there is one where the Wracks can redeploy which could be nice?
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amishprn86
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PostSubject: Re: Prophets of Flesh Ground Force    Sun Apr 01 2018, 14:56

Why not both? Are you locked to 500pts?

If i did coven (And i will time to time) I'm going to have something like 30 Wracks, 18-20 Grots, 4-5 Talos, 1-3 Cronos and 2-3 Haemonculus along with 2-3 Reapers for AT.

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Quauchtemoc
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PostSubject: Re: Prophets of Flesh Ground Force    Sun Apr 01 2018, 15:05

Why not scourge for the AT ? Its almost fluff
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ShamPow1999
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PostSubject: Re: Prophets of Flesh Ground Force    Sun Apr 01 2018, 15:08

@amishprn86

You’re right, and you’d have to take wracks for this Patrol Detatchment anyway, I was just thinking that Wracks aren’t simply a straight upgrade to Grotesques.

Do you think you’d still be able to get your bubble working with multiple units of Wracks, Grotesques and the Talos?
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PostSubject: Re: Prophets of Flesh Ground Force    Sun Apr 01 2018, 15:09

If you spread your unit i think its possible yes
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ShamPow1999
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PostSubject: Re: Prophets of Flesh Ground Force    Sun Apr 01 2018, 15:41

@Quauchtemoc

If you’re taking another two Patrol detatchements, then you may as well get your anti tank from a Kabal as it nets you additional CPs and gives you enough shooting to support your footslogging units. At least that’s what I think.

Scourges would probably be absolutely necessary if you intended on footslogging multiple Coven detatchments.
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PostSubject: Re: Prophets of Flesh Ground Force    Sun Apr 01 2018, 15:43

Ah yes i was talking about a pure coven army, but yes you are rigth
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PostSubject: Re: Prophets of Flesh Ground Force    Sun Apr 01 2018, 15:55

@Quauchtemoc wrote:
Why not scourge for the AT ? Its almost fluff

Reapers are <coven> fits the theme and can get +1 toughness

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PostSubject: Re: Prophets of Flesh Ground Force    Sun Apr 01 2018, 15:58

Ravagers are so much better than reapers though, better to take a kabal patrol for them.

One issue with the 20 wracks idea, going off the index you actually can only make wrack units 10 max,  which seems odd to me especially for a troop unit. I hope that changes in the codex, especially because the prophets of flesh stratagem is definitely better for a big 20 wrack horde. I will definitely be trying a unit of 10 wracks on foot as objective holders/tie up unit.

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PostSubject: Re: Prophets of Flesh Ground Force    Sun Apr 01 2018, 16:00

@Lord Asvaldir wrote:
Ravagers are so much better than reapers though, better to take a kabal patrol for them.

One issue with the 20 wracks idea, going off the index you actually can only make wrack units 10 max,  which seems odd to me especially for a troop unit. I hope that changes in the codex, especially because the prophets of flesh stratagem is definitely better for a big 20 wrack horde. I will definitely be trying a unit of 10 wracks on foot as objective holders/tie up unit.

Im taking Reapers b.c i wanted a full Coven list to fit the theme. My Talos will also have HWB honestly.... b.c they all are fitted with them still from CTC formation.

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PostSubject: Re: Prophets of Flesh Ground Force    Sun Apr 01 2018, 17:22

Ah ok tbh i didnt know what was the Reaper ah ah . But considering Scourge are coven creation i allways see them as coven unit somehow
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PostSubject: Re: Prophets of Flesh Ground Force    Sun Apr 01 2018, 21:27

@Quauchtemoc wrote:
Ah ok tbh i didnt know what was the Reaper ah ah . But considering Scourge are coven creation i allways see them as coven unit somehow

They are actually rich Kabals that pay a haemonculus to give them wings, they are more like Kabal Mafia of the skys, they are hired assassins and sell secrets. So thats why they are merchs, just like Incubi and Mandrakes, b.c of that they fit into any army.

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