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 1k for 2v2 against Tau

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tegs
Kabalite Warrior
tegs

Posts : 133
Join date : 2016-07-13

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PostSubject: 1k for 2v2 against Tau   1k for 2v2 against Tau I_icon_minitimeSun Jan 07 2018, 00:15

I've got a 2v2 game coming up in a little while, and I'm trying to put together a list for it. My ally will be playing Craftworld, and we'll be taking on two Tau armies. Part of the challenge is that I've been playing Chaos thus far in 8E, but it seems serendipitous to bring DE alongside my ally's Craftworlders.

I think Tau add some challenges we don't usually face. You can't pick away at them from 36" safely because of the added range and S of pulse rifles, so I'm hesitant to go transport heavy. I'm pondering using Mandrakes, Scourges, and webwaying in a unit instead of relying on transports. Let the Craftworlder field WraithLords and Wave Serpents while we engage in Operation: Hide Behind the Crafties.

My primary focus will be battlesuits, since they're the most appealing target for splinter fire. By mathhammer, splinter fire inflicts more wounds per point than blasters to suits, with the gap getting larger with Doom/Jinx support. So I'm focusing on splinter fire primarily, with just enough darklight to help my ally deal with any vehicles we encounter.

This is what I'm starting with:
HQ
100: Farseer, Faolchu's Wings, Executioner, Doom
70: Warlock Skyrunner, Warlord, Fate's Messenger, Protect/Jinx
Troops
144: 20 warriors, splinter rifles, hiding in webway
35: 5 warriors, splinter rifles, sit on objective
35: 5 warriors, splinter rifles, in venom
80: Venom, 1 cannon, TL splinter rifles
Elites
95: 5 Mandrakes
Fast Attack
130: 5 Scourges, 4 blasters
70: 5 Scourges, carbines
70: 5 Scourges, carbines
Flyer
175: Razorwing, 2 Dissies, TL splinter rifle

My ally will likely deploy everything on the table up front, so I'm free to deep strike a lot of stuff without worrying about the RWJ being the only target on the board.

I'm hoping to drop everything in turn 2 or 3, focus fire suits, soak OW with the 20 warriors charging as many units as possible, and then charging the scourges and mandrakes in as well. Particularly in turn three with the +1 to hit, warriors should krump fire warriors and kroot right proppa. My ally is considering bringing 10 banshees to help mitigate OW, but that isn't confirmed yet.

I'm pondering dropping the Venom and bringing the 20 warriors down to 5 in order to webway in 10 incubi instead. There's a psychological advantage since one of my opponents is phobic about incubi after some nastiness back in 7E. My concern is that incubi are probably overkill against Tau troops, I can't be quite as cavalier about throwing their lives away compared to warriors, and I lose the ability to level 40 splinter shots at a battlesuit and then charge a different troop unit afterwards.

Thoughts?

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wormfromhell
Sybarite
wormfromhell

Posts : 326
Join date : 2017-01-02
Location : Australia, the land of the $85 Ravager.

1k for 2v2 against Tau Empty
PostSubject: Re: 1k for 2v2 against Tau   1k for 2v2 against Tau I_icon_minitimeSun Jan 07 2018, 03:37

i've played 3 games against tau this edition, and if you are going to charge them, you need an all-out charge. supporting fire is deadly against our troops, you will need vehicles to soak it up. also, be weary that because most of their stuff can fly, he can fall back and shoot you up, making charging useless unless you will wipe him in 1 turn.

Overall, I have found that Incubi in venoms are ideal, a unit of 5 can reliably take on a unit of 3 crisis suits. while they are moving in, you will need to hide the venoms. If he has kroot, you want to charge them as they do not have supporting fire. Don't bother with stealth suits, they are sooooo tough and will take a disproportionate amount of firepower to kill, they are distractions.

Pulse weapons are also quite weak against us, especially since they are hitting venoms on 5's, and wound on 4's and we get a 4+ save, so only 1 in 12 pulse shots will do a wound to a venom, so each venom can take 72 pulse shots. really be careful of missile pods, they are your main target with their range and damage output.

Ultimately, send tons of incubi venoms at him, hiding in cover as you move up and charging his crisis suits, ignore stealth suits, and maybe DS some mandrakes to take out strike teams/pathfinders. Don't be afraid to use incubi against fire warriors, better to have them wiped than still alive because you didn't bring incubi. Also, having a majority incubi army will FREAK OUT your phobic enemy, which will make him focus them and give the craftworlder some room.


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CptMetal
Trueborn
CptMetal

Posts : 2937
Join date : 2015-03-02
Location : Ruhr Metropolian Area

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PostSubject: Re: 1k for 2v2 against Tau   1k for 2v2 against Tau I_icon_minitimeSun Jan 07 2018, 09:37

How many 5 men squads in venom do you recommend at 1000 points?
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tegs
Kabalite Warrior
tegs

Posts : 133
Join date : 2016-07-13

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PostSubject: Re: 1k for 2v2 against Tau   1k for 2v2 against Tau I_icon_minitimeSun Jan 07 2018, 10:51

Wouldn't I be better off doing a five pack of harlies in a starweaver at that point?

I'm kind of tempted to put in a two 5 packs of banshees in a WS myself if my opponent decides against it.  Muck up the Tau overwatch thing entirely.

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Dodo_Night
Kabalite Warrior
Dodo_Night

Posts : 102
Join date : 2011-10-22

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PostSubject: Re: 1k for 2v2 against Tau   1k for 2v2 against Tau I_icon_minitimeWed Jan 10 2018, 06:08


Unless the detachment is pure drukhari, you won't be benefitting from power from pain. The buffs over time really start to come in to effect for us, especially turn 3 for our assault units. reroll charges and +1 to hit? very nice ^^

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|Meavar
Hekatrix
|Meavar

Posts : 1041
Join date : 2017-01-26

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PostSubject: Re: 1k for 2v2 against Tau   1k for 2v2 against Tau I_icon_minitimeWed Jan 10 2018, 06:33


Why do you need to be a pure drukhari detechment? Just any drukhari unit benefits, we do not yet have any of the codex bonusses where you need a pure detachment except for the stratagem and warlord traits in chapter approved?
PFP is just an special rule most of our units have.
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tegs
Kabalite Warrior
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Join date : 2016-07-13

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PostSubject: Re: 1k for 2v2 against Tau   1k for 2v2 against Tau I_icon_minitimeThu Jan 11 2018, 01:05

You don't need a drukhari detachment for the warlord trait, but do need one for the stratagem. I was reworking the list anyway, so I'll add in a second pure Drukhari detachment.

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Kabalite Warrior
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PostSubject: Re: 1k for 2v2 against Tau   1k for 2v2 against Tau I_icon_minitimeThu Jan 11 2018, 02:11

Here's what I'm looking at now:

HQ:
58 - Archon, warlord, hatred eternal, parasite's kiss
35 - warlock, protect/jinx
35 - warlock, conceal/reveal

Troops:
56 - 8 warriors, splinter rifles
35 - 5 warriors, splinter rifles
35 - 5 warriors, splinter rifles

Elites:
180 - 10 incubi, will webway in
114 - 6 mandrakes
31 - Sslyth

Fast Attack:
150 - 5 scourges, 4 dark lances, 1 splinter carbine

Flyer:
155 - Razorwing Jetfighter, 2 DLs, TL splinter rifle

Transports:
116 - Raider, DL, shock prow

The Archon and Elites will form a vanguard detachment to get access to webway.

The incubi will DS in via webway, the mandrakes and scourges will also DS in.  The Archon, Sslyth, and 8 warriors will go in the raider, and the two warrior packs will sit on objectives.  I'll have to rely on my ally to provide transport for the warlocks, and to provide a farseer for doom.

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Kabalite Warrior
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Join date : 2016-07-13

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PostSubject: Re: 1k for 2v2 against Tau   1k for 2v2 against Tau I_icon_minitimeFri Jan 19 2018, 17:27

A few updates.

I've got one of my enemies' lists.  He's going to have to adjust it because he's 35 points over, but I don't think it'll change much:
Supreme command+1cp 996pts 3CP's total.
hq- commander 76pts +fussion blaster 21pts x4(84ptrs) = 160pts +10pts marker drone x2 (20)180pts total
hq- commander 76pts +fussion blaster 21pts x4(84ptrs) = 160pts +10pts marker drone x2 (20)180pts total
HQ- Commander cold star (Stim injector, Shield, Missle pod, High output burst cannon) 164pts **Warlord: Feel no pain warlord trait (+6pts shield drone x2(12pts)
LOW-storm surge 180ptspulse blast cannon +43pts, +20 sms x2 (40), +9pts flammer x2 (18), +40pts shield gen, Velocity tracker+10pts, EWO +8pts, cluster rockets +61 pts, deystroyer missle +10pts x4 (40)=440pts

Elt - Crisis body guard team x 45pts (+9pts flammer x3(27))=72pts -1cp understrength unit

I expect the other Tau army will be infantry heavy as this list is way too points dense otherwise.  Maybe a Riptide.  I was expecting a lot of velocity trackers since all our vehicles have the fly keyword, but I won't complain if they decide against leveraging that.


My Craftworld ally has asked me to make up their list as well.  Their farseer will have doom, but they'll pick other powers at game.  Here's what I'm thinking.

Alaitoc battalion, 6 CP:
Farseer, warlord, morale immunity within 6" WL trait, will have doom, marches up with guardians
Warlock, goes in a WS
3 x 10 guardians
2 x 5 banshees, exarchs have mirrorswords, one in each WS
5 wraithguard to be webwayed in
2 wave serpents with spirit stones and 3 x shuriken cannons

Eldar battalion, DE vanguard, 7 CP:
2 warlocks, one with protect/jinx, other with quicken/restrain
1 archon, warlord, eternal hatred, agoniser, relic splinter pistol, goes in raider
20 warriors, sybarite has agoniser, will webway in
5 warriors, splinter rifles, will sit on an objective
6 warriors, sybarite has phantasm grenade launcher, goes in raider
10 incubi, will webway in
5 mandrakes, will DS
1 ssylth bodyguard, goes in raider
5 scourges, splinter carbines, will DS
razorwing jetfighter, 2 dark lances, TL splinter rifle, missiles
Raider, shock prow, dark lance

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Kabalite Warrior
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Join date : 2016-07-13

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PostSubject: Re: 1k for 2v2 against Tau   1k for 2v2 against Tau I_icon_minitimeSun Jan 21 2018, 15:27

This game went really well despite a bunch of mistakes.  My ally and I maintained really good control of objectives, and ended up with 14 VP to our opponent's 9.

Things definitely didn't go as planned, but it worked out anyway.  My ally decided at the last minute to put all the banshees in one WS, which they DS'd to the wrong side of the board away from all the juicy troop targets, while the other WS carried the wraithguard and my two warlocks and deployed on the opposite end of the board so my locks ended up too far away from the rest of our army to accomplish anything.  He also played entirely too conservatively, keeping units in the wave serpents a turn or two longer than he should have.  So there's going to be a discussion about that in the near future.

Largely because the banshees were in the wrong place, I didn't have any good targets to charge with the incubi and mandrakes, so they were blown to pieces without doing much damage first.  The Tau were still terrified of them, and dedicated an entire turn to annihilating the banshees and incubi, which was probably necessary since they would have been able to charge their troops if they hadn't.

The archon held one of the objectives, and his retinue and the reaver were all annihilated, so I webwayed the 20 warriors around him to lock down the objective.  I stretched them out a bit so that most of them were within 24", and they and the scourges killed one of the commanders and got the SS to half wounds so it lost a point of BS.  It was amusing that the archon only got in a single charge and spent the rest of the game hiding behind warriors, but the objective and not giving up Slay the Warlord was more important than his pride.

The jet fighter was blasted off the board in turn 1, which made me a little sad, but part of the whole point of it was to present a hard to hit target that they couldn't afford to ignore, so it was points well spent.


High point of the game; the Tau had to hold two objectives to get 2 VP, and the one player pulled all his units off one of the objectives to put the boots into the remaining wraithguard.  He killed the wraithguard, but cost them 2 VP.  There was a lot of "OMG, what did I just do!"  Laughing

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