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Filip Hanell
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PostSubject: Dark Eldar Army List   Fri Oct 13 2017, 20:13

Hello! Kind of new to this forum, or at least this my first post. (Like this forum very much)

I'am going to a tournament in a few weeks and I wonder what I should bring with me. Thought I could get some useful tips and tricks. Anyway, this is what I think I will bring with me:

HQ
Archon + Huskblade
Succubus + Agoniser

This guys will be with the wyches in a raider.

Troops
Kabalite Warriors 10 models in a raider witch one blaster and splinter cannon. 4 Squads
Wyches 8 models with agoniser and shardenet and impaler. Also within a raider.

Fast Attack
3 reavers

Heavy Support
3 Ravagers, Dark lances

The tournament is 1750 points and my list as it is now, 1749 points.

Could a fellow Archon gets some help?
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Darkin
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PostSubject: Re: Dark Eldar Army List   Sat Oct 14 2017, 19:10

-so from my past games I think wyches and the succubus arent good, Kabalies are eh... well take then if u want but I like to play lists without them
-the Huskhblade is a trap, the agonizer is better in any way
-Splinter cannons are bad for their points as well, if you play kabalites in 10 men squads what I wouldn't recommend then go with DL's
-Reavers are Garbage, don't use them

oh and we have a specific forum for arms lists go post this there!
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Thor665
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PostSubject: Re: Dark Eldar Army List   Sat Oct 14 2017, 19:38

Moved this topic to Army Lists, where it belongs.

@Filip Hanell wrote:
Archon + Huskblade
Succubus + Agoniser

This guys will be with the wyches in a raider.
I'd suggest an Agoniser over a Huskblade any day.

@Filip Hanell wrote:
Troops
Kabalite Warriors 10 models in a raider witch one blaster and splinter cannon. 4 Squads
Wyches 8 models with agoniser and shardenet and impaler. Also within a raider.
Maxed Kabalite squads are kinda 'meh' The Splinter Cannon is also kind of an inferior weapon selection. I would drop 5 guys and the s.cannon off those squads in a hot second.
Even if you wanted to stick with the 10 man Warrior units, I would ote that just droppng the splinter cannons would net you 60 points (and 70 points would buy you 5 Scourges, which would give you more poison shooting by a substantial margin than the s.cannons would)

I would advocate dropping the shardnet and Impaler for the generally superior Hydragauntlets, re-rolling to wound will probably overall help you cause more damage than the 2 damage of the impaler will.

@Filip Hanell wrote:
Fast Attack
3 reavers
If you're not taking them to provide mortal wounds or to carry special weapons fast and far into enemy lines I would suggest there is no good reason to take Reavers, you're paying a high price for what is, at the end of the day, basically a Kabalite Warrior with 2 wounds. At 90 points I would suggest both Scourges and Hellions are better options for providing poison shooting and/or assault power than Reavers will be.

@Filip Hanell wrote:
Heavy Support
3 Ravagers, Dark lances
Can't go wrong with Ravagers in basically any combination.

My thoughts,
Thor

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Filip Hanell
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PostSubject: Re: Dark Eldar Army List   Sat Oct 14 2017, 20:07

@Darkin wrote:
-so from my past games I think wyches and the succubus arent good, Kabalies are eh... well take then if u want but I like to play lists without them
-the Huskhblade is a trap, the agonizer is better in any way
-Splinter cannons are bad for their points as well, if you play kabalites in 10 men squads what I wouldn't recommend then go with DL's
-Reavers are Garbage, don't use them

oh and we have a specific forum for arms lists go post this there!

@Thor665 wrote:
Moved this topic to Army Lists, where it belongs.

Filip Hanell wrote:
Archon + Huskblade
Succubus + Agoniser

This guys will be with the wyches in a raider.
I'd suggest an Agoniser over a Huskblade any day.

Filip Hanell wrote:
Troops
Kabalite Warriors 10 models in a raider witch one blaster and splinter cannon. 4 Squads
Wyches 8 models with agoniser and shardenet and impaler. Also within a raider.
Maxed Kabalite squads are kinda 'meh' The Splinter Cannon is also kind of an inferior weapon selection. I would drop 5 guys and the s.cannon off those squads in a hot second.
Even if you wanted to stick with the 10 man Warrior units, I would ote that just droppng the splinter cannons would net you 60 points (and 70 points would buy you 5 Scourges, which would give you more poison shooting by a substantial margin than the s.cannons would)

I would advocate dropping the shardnet and Impaler for the generally superior Hydragauntlets, re-rolling to wound will probably overall help you cause more damage than the 2 damage of the impaler will.

Filip Hanell wrote:
Fast Attack
3 reavers
If you're not taking them to provide mortal wounds or to carry special weapons fast and far into enemy lines I would suggest there is no good reason to take Reavers, you're paying a high price for what is, at the end of the day, basically a Kabalite Warrior with 2 wounds. At 90 points I would suggest both Scourges and Hellions are better options for providing poison shooting and/or assault power than Reavers will be.

Filip Hanell wrote:
Heavy Support
3 Ravagers, Dark lances
Can't go wrong with Ravagers in basically any combination.

My thoughts,
Thor

Thank you both for the comments!

I played a game today against a Guard player and got my ass kicked. The wyches did nothing, as you said and the Archon and Succubus did crap. Reavers did nothing but I didn't have any other models so that's why I took them. Did nothing as well.

My Ravagers and Raider died hard versus his 3 super Leman Russes who could shot 2D6 plasma with the main cannons only. Pask also gave them rerolls on top on that. Did not help to take them down as I rolled crap today, as useally.

I have thought too buy some other models. Like Incubis, because Ogres are really strong and annyoing. They can also be good against Terminators?

I have had no luck with my blasters at all. Think I got in one blaster to do 2 wounds on a Leman Russ.

If you drop the Kabalites in half, would it be better to take venoms instead of Raiders? Because Raiders really cost alot with more added. 5 Cost about 575 points total without even counthing the Kabalites.

Will drop the splinter cannons because they didn't do much either.

The Scurges looks really cool as a model. What weapon do u usally take on them?

I know I ask alot of questions but with the switch to 8 edition I don't really understand how the Dark Eldar army should be played. Even less as a started at the end of 7 edition. I have played for the most part of my time the the Nids.
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Darkin
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PostSubject: Re: Dark Eldar Army List   Sat Oct 14 2017, 20:30

okay so this is a big debate on this forum but for me the Razorwing is the superior Ravanger. it will tank more wounds for the same price and has 2 DL's and some flexible rockets

also in my olist is have 10 incubi because i personally like them and yes they are good against anything with high armour value and low target/health pool they'll chew through them

as for the Raiders, sick with them. if you don't play Balstborn (Trueborn with Blazers) don't play Venoms. They aren't as Cost-effective

scourges are... well again if you like their models then go for it they aren't bad at all. the thing is you should play them with Dl's to be effectively a Deepstriking Devastator squad but you play 155 for 5 wounds with 5+/6++ if im not mistaken were you would be better off with a ravanger or Razprwing who can tank a lot more shots but doesn't pack that much of a punch

for a general Idea for playing dark eldar. if you know the movie Fast and furious then you know our playstyle. we sacrifice A LOT of our defensive stats for mobility and so we have o use our main strength to their best extent. always stay just in fire/rapid fire range and choose your battle carefully, pick of units that try to flank or are generally solo.
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Thor665
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PostSubject: Re: Dark Eldar Army List   Sat Oct 14 2017, 21:09

@Filip Hanell wrote:
I played a game today against a Guard player and got my ass kicked. The wyches did nothing, as you said and the Archon and Succubus did crap. Reavers did nothing but I didn't have any other models so that's why I took them. Did nothing as well.
I feel like Wyches and a Succubus aided by an Archon should have been able to do quite reasonable  work against Guard. What were you assaulting into exactly?

@Filip Hanell wrote:
My Ravagers and Raider died hard versus his 3 super Leman Russes who could shot 2D6 plasma with the main cannons only. Pask also gave them rerolls on top on that. Did not help to take them down as I rolled crap today, as useally.
On a non bad dice day your Ravagers and Raiders should be able to do quite well against Executioner Russ builds. I would advise not losing hope in them. The poster who commented on Razorwing Jetfighters is correct that those are also awesome units (I personally don't choose, and just take Ravagers *and* Razorwings)

@Filip Hanell wrote:
I have thought too buy some other models. Like Incubis, because Ogres are really strong and annyoing. They can also be good against Terminators?
Incubi are great vs. Terminators, and not shabby vs. Ogryns, though I would also note that Dissies are good options for them as well.

@Filip Hanell wrote:
I have had no luck with my blasters at all. Think I got in one blaster to do 2 wounds on a Leman Russ.
You've only got 4 in the list (I typically run around 6-8 at 1750) so I wouldn't lose heart. Once you open up some points you can maybe get some more in, and you'll find they do excellent work.

@Filip Hanell wrote:
If you drop the Kabalites in half, would it be better to take venoms instead of Raiders? Because Raiders really cost alot with more added. 5 Cost about 575 points total without even counthing the Kabalites.
Raiders cost 35 points more than a Venom, and the two serve totally different purposes as far as target priority goes - one hunts mech and heavy infantry, the other hunts light infantry (both hunt monstrous creatures). I tend to run a mix of units in my army, but usually find more of a desire to field Raiders than I do to field Venoms. If you're planning on sticking with your big Wych assault tool, I would tend to advocate sticking to the Raiders for now, as you'll already have a lot of points sunk into infantry killing.

@Filip Hanell wrote:
The Scurges looks really cool as a model. What weapon do u usally take on them?
The general consensus is to take them for tank hunting (and if you do this maybe contemplate taking some Venoms) with either 4 Dark Lances or 4 Blasters - there are pros and cons to each build. I favor Blasters for affordability, and the lack of shooting penalties when moving. People who like the Dark Lance appreciate the range allowing the Scourges to hide and survive longer, and prefer the larger ability to inflict damage.
You can also field them very cheaply to spam shardcarbines if you want anti-infantry tools.

@Filip Hanell wrote:
I know I ask alot of questions but with the switch to 8 edition I don't really understand how the Dark Eldar army should be played. Even less as a started at the end of 7 edition. I have played for the most part of my time the the Nids.
We are generally best played, in my opinion, with the awareness that we are fragile, and tend to need a lot of support to properly destroy enemy units.
Use your mobility to try to keep it so 100% of your army is shooting/stabbing your opponent and only 50% of his army can hit you back.

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Mppqlmd
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PostSubject: Re: Dark Eldar Army List   Sat Oct 14 2017, 21:45

Quote :
I know I ask alot of questions but with the switch to 8 edition I don't really understand how the Dark Eldar army should be played. Even less as a started at the end of 7 edition. I have played for the most part of my time the the Nids.

Dark Eldar have lost quite a lot of CC power and low-range power, but have gained supreme AT long-ranged power.

The way i play them (and i'm not the only one) : spam DL and dissies, play the range game for some 2-3 turns, then close in and butcher the lonely remaining units. I feel like rushing in in the first turns is not very wise with the current state of our army.

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PostSubject: Re: Dark Eldar Army List   Sun Oct 15 2017, 09:43

@Thor665 wrote:
I feel like Wyches and a Succubus aided by an Archon should have been able to do quite reasonable work against Guard. What were you assaulting into exactly?


They didn't charge anything, the got charge by a unit of Ogres and Yarrik. That.s why they didn't do anything.

I will definently think about getting more blasters as you said Thor665. You have really help me getting some perspective into the Dark eldar army.

@Mppqlmd wrote:
Dark Eldar have lost quite a lot of CC power and low-range power, but have gained supreme AT long-ranged power.

The way i play them (and i'm not the only one) : spam DL and dissies, play the range game for some 2-3 turns, then close in and butcher the lonely remaining units. I feel like rushing in in the first turns is not very wise with the current state of our army.

That is also what I tried to do. Rush in. I thought he had much better range then me so I tried to take the fight to him. Which was not the case. At least I have learned alot from just this one match.
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PostSubject: Re: Dark Eldar Army List   Sun Oct 15 2017, 09:59

That's why i don't recommend blasters in this edition. They kinda require to rush in. I feel much safer and much more efficient spamming Dark Lances on everything (including 10man kabalite squads), as well as dissies.

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Filip Hanell
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PostSubject: Re: Dark Eldar Army List   Sun Oct 15 2017, 11:29

@Mppqlmd wrote:
That's why i don't recommend blasters in this edition. They kinda require to rush in. I feel much safer and much more efficient spamming Dark Lances on everything (including 10man kabalite squads), as well as dissies.

Could you not have 10 man Kabalites in Raider with Dark Lances. That could be effective. If I'am right, if you move with the Raider the passagers won't get a pennalty because they basically didn't move or I'am far away from the truth?
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PostSubject: Re: Dark Eldar Army List   Sun Oct 15 2017, 11:44

You can give a DL to a 10man kabalite squad in a raider. I love that configuration.

But they do get a -1 to hit when you move the raider. They still count as moving.

2 things though :
- With range 36", moving is not always mandatory.
- Hitting on 4+ is still good.

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Darkin
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PostSubject: Re: Dark Eldar Army List   Sun Oct 15 2017, 15:58

@Mppqlmd wrote:
That's why i don't recommend blasters in this edition. They kinda require to rush in. I feel much safer and much more efficient spamming Dark Lances on everything (including 10man kabalite squads), as well as dissies.

i thought Blastbron are really good right now, no?
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PostSubject: Re: Dark Eldar Army List   Sun Oct 15 2017, 16:09

I don't find them to be good. But that doesn't necessarily mean they are bad.

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PostSubject: Re: Dark Eldar Army List   Sun Oct 15 2017, 16:48

There's a lot of stuff that can get in your face very, very quickly in this edition. I prefer spreading Blasters out across Kabalite units instead of running a single Trueborn unit with them, but it's very rarely the case that I have to run in to get a shot off with Blasters. Frequently I'm having to run away with them.
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PostSubject: Re: Dark Eldar Army List   Sun Oct 15 2017, 18:49

@Burnage wrote:
There's a lot of stuff that can get in your face very, very quickly in this edition. I prefer spreading Blasters out across Kabalite units instead of running a single Trueborn unit with them, but it's very rarely the case that I have to run in to get a shot off with Blasters. Frequently I'm having to run away with them.
I'll second this on everything being said.

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PostSubject: Re: Dark Eldar Army List   Sun Oct 15 2017, 22:41

@Darkin wrote:
@Mppqlmd wrote:
That's why i don't recommend blasters in this edition. They kinda require to rush in. I feel much safer and much more efficient spamming Dark Lances on everything (including 10man kabalite squads), as well as dissies.

i thought Blastbron are really good right now, no?

The blaster is a good mobile weapon that works excellent on heavy infantry with a high save. But you first need to get into range. Your choices are Trueborn in Venoms (expensive and Venoms prefer other targets) or Scourges (very squishy).

With Blasters, Scourges are likely to survive 1-2 rounds max and I feel this is not enough for their investment. But for just 20pts more you get a full squad with Lances, which you can place anywhere you want. Far more important than the D6 damage, I find the 36" range to have a huge impact.

The range of the Lances allow you to position them in areas where they are in cover or cannot be shot by the enemy's main AI. And if you got a good spot, you don't even need to move with them and snipe the enemies from afar. And on top, you can even threaten enemy vehicles with the D6 damage.

If you really want to get in close and deal a lot of precision damage, use Mandrakes. They hurt a lot in the shooting and fighting phase and at least they tie up something in combat afterwards.

Edit:

@Mppqlmd wrote:
Quote :
...

Dark Eldar have lost quite a lot of CC power and low-range power, but have gained supreme AT long-ranged power.

The way i play them (and i'm not the only one) : spam DL and dissies, play the range game for some 2-3 turns, then close in and butcher the lonely remaining units. I feel like rushing in in the first turns is not very wise with the current state of our army.

May I ask what you use as main platforms for Disintegrators and Lances?
I tend to use Scourges + Raiders for Lances (and on on the Kabalites) and 1 Ravager for Disintegrators.

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PostSubject: Re: Dark Eldar Army List   Sun Oct 15 2017, 22:43

Quote :
If you really want to get in close and deal a lot of precision damage, use Mandrakes. They hurt a lot in the shooting and fighting phase and at least they tie up something in combat afterwards.

They are also cheaper than Blasterborn, don't require a vehicle, are sturdier (due to 5++ and "Hard to hit"), can work well against Inv saves, and can fight in CC.

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PostSubject: Re: Dark Eldar Army List   Mon Oct 16 2017, 12:40

so you guys say blastborn arent worth taking?
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