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 DE Codex Wishlisting

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Archon_91
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PostSubject: Re: DE Codex Wishlisting   Thu Oct 05 2017, 22:15

We had that exact same piece of wargear in 6th and 7th ...
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Mppqlmd
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PostSubject: Re: DE Codex Wishlisting   Thu Oct 05 2017, 22:18

Archon_91 wrote:
We had that exact same piece of wargear in 6th and 7th ...
I need to get some sleep ^^
The WHFB item was called "Hotek's Ring" and was indeed very similar to the Helm of Spite.

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Archon_91
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PostSubject: Re: DE Codex Wishlisting   Thu Oct 05 2017, 22:46

Then get some lol and thanks for the list of mortal wound weapons I don't know how I forgot the Voidraven ... As for the others ... I never really looked that close at the weapons as I've never really used the coven, nor the court of the archon. And I use only basic hellions, no special weapons on them
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FuelDrop
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PostSubject: Re: DE Codex Wishlisting   Fri Oct 06 2017, 00:04

We do have a lot of vectors for mortal wounds.

We have very few reliable, reusable vectors for mortal wounds. Most of them are rolling 6's, a majority are close combat related, And there are only a couple that can deal multiple mortal wounds (and most of them require a lot of luck and at least one is not reusable).

Our best reusable vector for mortal wounds is probably Mandrakes, and even then you average one mortal wound for a five elf team's full shooting. Their shooting is pretty solid in its own right which helps a lot, but that still isn't exactly spammable.

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Faitherun
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PostSubject: Re: DE Codex Wishlisting   Fri Oct 06 2017, 04:31

My friends and I have house-rules smite to be a flat 1 wounds, unless an 11 is rolled, then its a flat 3.

Although, this was my first observation of 8th - we need psychic defense this edition now more than ever! Please give us a helm of spite again!

Also, and shame on all of you, but SHOCK PROWS! Probably the best and cheapest vector for mortal wounds we, or for that matter, any army can take.

I love to ram my crippled raiders into enemy lines, and just dare them to blow it up. Exploding vehicles have won me a game more than once.. Speaking of - that stratagem death guard got to make vehicles explode... that would be very, very nice on a talos / cronos...

I want to see more dirty tricks. More High Risk High Reward play. I miss the old drug dispensers - take all you want, but you just might kill yourself in the process...
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TheBaconPope
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PostSubject: Re: DE Codex Wishlisting   Fri Oct 06 2017, 04:36

Quote :
Also, and shame on all of you, but SHOCK PROWS! Probably the best and cheapest vector for mortal wounds we, or for that matter, any army can take.

Last I checked, shock prows just upped damage, nothing about mortal wounds in their rules

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BlackDeathstill
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PostSubject: Re: DE Codex Wishlisting   Fri Oct 06 2017, 06:08

Bring back Lady Malys. Give her a 6" aura ability against psychic, maybe 5+ to deny rolls.
Create characters Followers of Malys give them a 3" aura at 6+ to deny. Like a reverse warlock conclave.

Bring back Baron Sathonyx. Hellions units within *inches gain maybe some kinda cover save even in the open, kinda of a Dodge type move against ranged weapons.

VECT! Sheez.

This whole wych suit thing, 6+. Maybe create a grenade that when thrown during a charge move ignores overwatch but in a regular movement delegates a +1 cover even in open ground. The grenade can be used instead of a phantasm by a Hekatrix or Syren.

And the ever loved, jetbike or sky board for characters.

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|Meavar
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PostSubject: Re: DE Codex Wishlisting   Fri Oct 06 2017, 07:05

TheBaconPope wrote:
Quote :
Also, and shame on all of you, but SHOCK PROWS! Probably the best and cheapest vector for mortal wounds we, or for that matter, any army can take.

Last I checked, shock prows just upped damage, nothing about mortal wounds in their rules

I think what he means is you charge and thus get close enough that if you die you might kill enemies in the blast if you explode.

Dark Elf Dave wrote:

How is it "very good against some targets and useless against others"

It deals D3/D6 mortal wounds against any target so it is useful against everything.

Yes it deals d3/d6 wounds against everything.

Killing a space marine with a lascannon (around 30 points) is nice with smite
Damaging a 12 wound vehicle worth 200 points is ok
Killing a imperial guardsmen with a lasgun (4 points) is a waste of smite

Since smite deals the same damage for nearly (disgustingly resilient etc are exceptions) everything, it means if you do a mortal wound against a t8 2+ 4++ thing you saved yourself a lot of expensive shots, if you kill a guardsman you saved yourself a few cheap ass shots.

While smite might do the same against everything if I make sure smite can only hurt my ravenwing flocks then you might cast smite every turn and only kill 42 points if you do the same against a fully tooled up reaver unit you will kill roughly 40 points a turn (240 for 6 reavers with grav talons and heat lances). In those cases I would not call them as effective. Why is a dark lance not an effective anti meq weapon, it does more damage on average to MEQ then a splinter rifle. Because the rifle is way cheaper it is still the better option. If you shoot at t2 no save units with smite, you are better of buying a bunch of kabalites and killing it faster and cheaper.
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Dark Elf Dave
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PostSubject: Re: DE Codex Wishlisting   Fri Oct 06 2017, 08:56

Mppqlmd wrote:
Yep, its existance serves that purpose, i think you're right.
But i see a lot of "Mortal wounds are great against everything" around here, and that's just not true. They actually serve a pretty specific role !

Can't agree

It is my point of view that Smite is strong against everything because of the way it works...it goes off with relative ease and causes almost guaranteed damage. It has to be one of the most widely available (to everyone else) weapons that is the most consistent at causing damage.

If someone decides to use smite against Conscripts then that it is up to them...you can knock the player but don't knock the weapon.

I am not saying Smite is the best weapon in the game at all...but I feel its strength lies in its consistency. When that dreadnought or tank or MC is sat in front of you with 1-2 wounds left, Smite is very powerful at guaranteeing a kill.
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Mppqlmd
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PostSubject: Re: DE Codex Wishlisting   Fri Oct 06 2017, 09:49

Quote :
When that dreadnought or tank or MC is sat in front of you with 1-2 wounds left, Smite is very powerful at guaranteeing a kill
Being able to kill a tank with 1-2 wounds left is so specific i hardly could call that consistency.

Mortal wounds, appart from the completly underpriced brimstone horrors, is not reliable at all. It's not good against hordes, it's not going at destroying big things (how many smites for a Baneblade ?), it's only good at killing high-save/high-T, low-wounds models.

I'm not saying it's bad. It has its role. But its not the 8th edition equivalent to D-strength : the "destroy everything" button. It's a lot more balanced than that (except, again, for brimstones that are underpriced).

I'm just stating this because i saw a lot of "Voidravens/smites are OP, because mortal wounds are the best thing in the game". That's just not true.

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Dark Elf Dave
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PostSubject: Re: DE Codex Wishlisting   Fri Oct 06 2017, 11:42

I am not talking about mortal wounds in general...I think Smite, although it causes mortal wounds, works differently.

There is a high chance it goes off, and it doesn't have to wound...it is automatic. Making it very dependable.

I have never said Smite is overpowered...I said it was very powerful.

You might feel as if taking out a dreadnought/tank/MC that has 1-2 wounds left too specific, but I don't. When you are at the mid-late stages of a game, everything is a little battered, you need to guarantee the high toughness target is taken out, Smite can be a game changer.

A Primaris Psyker at 40 points that can cause an almost guaranteed D3 mortal wounds is awesome no matter which way you look at it...and we don't get that for DE which is why going back to the original discussion, we need more protection from it.
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URIEN
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PostSubject: Re: DE Codex Wishlisting   Fri Oct 06 2017, 12:11

@ Mppqlmd. Klaivex's don't cause mortal wounds, just up the damage characteristic to 3 instead of 1... Thanks for pointing out the Shaimeshi blade though. I run a 4 body court most games (2 Sslyth, Lhamaen and a Medusae) as they're great fun and cool as hell rocking it in my Tantalus with my Archon. Complete oversight on my part.

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