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LordSplata
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PostSubject: Math hammer calculator   Tue Aug 08 2017, 08:34

Over the last few weeks I have been putting together a squad based mathhammer calculator for working out how many wounds are inflicted by varying weapons against different targets.

Latest Version
Mathhammer Calculator v1.2

Old Versions:
 

I have tried to make it simple and intuitive to use, but there is a read me on the first sheet which aims to describe how to use it just in case.

While there are a few mathhammer calculators out there the big thing that this one covers which I haven't seen other calcuators do is; you can put an entire squad (or vehicles weapons) into this one, with its points and get a full understanding of where all the points are actually going. Plus it stores weapon and enemy stats, with multiple areas to compare!

If you have any feedback i'd love to hear it, good or bad.

I'd like to thank the following members for helping me test it (in no particular order):
Barrywise, SquidMaster, Count Adhemar, Scrz, aurynn



Notes on this version:
- No graphing tool (this will be hard to implement in excel but I'd like to)
- Shock prow damage 6+ extra damage is not being accounted for.


Last edited by LordSplata on Thu Aug 31 2017, 10:22; edited 3 times in total
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lmrz
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PostSubject: Re: Math hammer calculator   Tue Aug 08 2017, 17:06

Nice work. When I get chance I'll have a little play and give you some feedback Smile
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Mppqlmd
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PostSubject: Re: Math hammer calculator   Tue Aug 08 2017, 21:43

Cool, i'll give it a shot Smile Thanks

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Barrywise
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PostSubject: Re: Math hammer calculator   Wed Aug 09 2017, 14:04

Thanks again for making this Lord Splata. Really good stuff. I'll message you/post here if I find any errors

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Lord Johan
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PostSubject: Re: Math hammer calculator   Thu Aug 10 2017, 17:26

Beautiful job. Thank you.

Feedback:

It is really well designed and looks good. It seems to read correctly for the first things I tried.


I tried Ossefactors because this was so hard for me to calculate personally (I did a table on ranged weapons not knowing you were also working on one). Now, here it reports 1 ossefactor at 3+ BS shooting at GEQ is 0.56 wounds. The ossefactor reads it wounds on 2+ with ap -3, and if it kills a model then it the unit suffers a mortal wound on a D6 roll of 4+. So I calculated this as 5/6 chance to wound, then on a 4+ you deal additional wound vs. GEQ. So at BS3+ this would equal 2/3 (to hit) * 5/6 (to wound) for wounds + P(WOUNDS) * 0.5 wounds, right? Equaling 0.55... + 0.277... for 0.83 wounds. Right? So it leads me to think the special rule is not factored in right now, or am I mistaken?

For the Liquifier it correctly identifies BS doesn't matter and gives 1.75 wounds vs GEQ based on D6 = 3.5 shots and wounds on a 4+ with average ap of -2, so no save for guardsmen, right? And 0.5*3.5=1.75. But shouldn't this actually be: vs. guardsmen the average ap is 1.66... because if you roll a 1-2 for ap then only 5/6 shots go through but if you roll a 5-6 for ap there is no advantage. So that would yield 3.5 * 0.5 * 5.66.../6 = appx 1.653 rather than 1.75 wounds, right?
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LordSplata
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PostSubject: Re: Math hammer calculator   Thu Aug 10 2017, 22:50

Really happy you are liking it.

On the ossefacor issue, it sounds like I haven't assigned the special rule to it, I'll fix that and update it. Good find.

The liquified gun, you are correct. Although, with the way I'm currently making assumptions for how a d3's result is a 2; modifiers where a random element is involved are incorrect. The good thing is this doesn't effect many weapons, in fact liquified guns and twin liquified guns are the only ones I can think of.
nothing has a random Str or hit modifier, and hence aren't impacted by this issue

Edit: liquified guns interacting with invulnerable saves where the difference between the invulnerable save and the save is 2 will also not give a correct result as the -1 on. D6 won't be taken into account . Ie. a 3+/5++
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Barrywise
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PostSubject: Re: Math hammer calculator   Sun Aug 13 2017, 13:41

I know in your previous beta version, you had a problem with multi-wound weapons and how that translates from Single "wounds" to Multi-wounds but you've completely cleared that up with this one. Absolutely beautiful work.

Also, the point efficiency is working like a charm. I really like how simple you made it so that it'll take the sum of the point values listed and then divide by both the single wounds and the multiwound targets. bloody excellent.

Also, out of curiosity, how did you do the wounding system for S/T ?

When I was attempting to start making one I was using "IF" statements on the excel spreadsheet. something like this:

=if (D7/$C$5 <= 0.5, RS!$B$2,if (D7/$C$5 >= 2, RS!$B$6,If(D7/$C$5 < 1, RS!$B$3,If(D7/$C$5 = 1, RS!B4, if(2 > D7/$C$5 > 1, RS!$B$5)))))

Where the excel spreadsheet reads it as " if (logical statement, Positive results, negative result)" where you can link the "if" statements together by putting another "if statement" into the negative result, similar to some programming languages.

In the above coding, I had:
D7 = weapons strength
C5 = Target Toughness ("$" keeps the following letter/number the same when dragging/copying)
RS = Resource Sheet (Dice rolls/percentages. "!" draws from separate page)
B2 = 1/6
through
B7 = 6/6

So the "logical statement" that I was going for was comparing D7/C5 or S/T

If anyone is still reading this and wants to learn Excel, you can use <, >, <=, >=, for less than, greater than, less than or equal to, and greater than or equal to respectively.

I started with the extremities with S/T being greater than 2 or less than 0.5. I probably should've done =1 next but oh well. still works, lol.

Was that something similar to what you did Lord Splata?

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Barrywise
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PostSubject: Re: Math hammer calculator   Sun Aug 13 2017, 14:41

Also, Sorry for the double post, but it's a different topic.

How do you add FnP to custom targets? I tried making a Talos with Toughness 6, 3+ armor, 5++ invuln and "FNP6"

Cause I think I got it... but I'm getting like 4 Lascannons cause 1 wound through, and that translates to 1 Multiwound.

Similar problem with Overcharged Plasma Guns

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LordSplata
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PostSubject: Re: Math hammer calculator   Thu Aug 17 2017, 00:38

Thanks for using it and finding these issues guys.
I have updated the OP with the latest version.

But here it is anyway:
Mathhammer Calculator v1.1

Ossefactor - now properly added, and as you say lord Johan, that was difficult! I had to had whole new sections to get it integrated.

Lascannons - I had the damage as 1 rather than D6. Woops! Thanks for finding that Barrywise!

To add FNP to custom targets you select it from the drop down menu in the targets area (which you were probably doing, just the weapon profile was busted!).

I'm not seeing a problem with the Plasma rifles though, and my profile for a T7 3+5++ FNP6 creature under Custom Target 3 seems to be behaving correctly. Check it out and tell me what you think.

My Toughness vs str calculation is on the "Rolls" page in column AA. Actually all my rolls are there, from to hit rolls through to FNP calcs.
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LordSplata
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PostSubject: Re: Math hammer calculator   Thu Aug 31 2017, 10:29

New version of the mathhammer excel file is here, with some neat updates
Version 1.2

This version handles multi wound models and squads better with targets having a wounds category as well!
Meaning a 6 damage dark light shot against a 2 wound marine works out at 2damage.
Also in it is reroll auras, cover and all those other special rules that effect weapons and attacks!

Enjoy
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Lord Johan
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PostSubject: Re: Math hammer calculator   Thu Aug 31 2017, 10:46

Hi, am I correct in saying that you have now factored in that vs a 2 wound target, a d6 darklight shot is 1.8333... damage and d3 is 1.666... damage? Because it seems that way when I tried the Void Lance (with auto-hit modifier) vs TEQ, this outputs 1.02 and the exact damage is 1.0185183... so the result now seems exactly correct.

Great work! It's now the most accurate thing out there.
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LordSplata
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PostSubject: Re: Math hammer calculator   Thu Aug 31 2017, 22:38

Cheers mate. That is exactly how I'm doing it, and it can handle a feel no pain roll in that calculation as well
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Mppqlmd
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PostSubject: Re: Math hammer calculator   Tue Sep 26 2017, 17:36

I think it could be interesting to pin this thread or find another mean to make the calculator more accessible/visible ? It's a fantastic tool really.

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Lord Johan
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PostSubject: Re: Math hammer calculator   Tue Sep 26 2017, 20:27

It is definitely underappreciated - I spent a few evenings figuring the math out, so I know Lord Splata spent a lot more. His tool is fantastic and includes unintuitive things like variable dmg for low W targets. There's no need to re-invent the wheel and have people try to figure out the same thing again and again every time, so stickying would be great.

E: I see it still does not track variable AP (liquifier gun), but that does not reduce its sticky-worthiness.
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Count Adhemar
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PostSubject: Re: Math hammer calculator   Tue Sep 26 2017, 22:29

Stickied - Count Adhemar

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