HomeDark Eldar WikiDark Eldar ResourcesNull CityFAQUsergroupsRegisterLog in
Share | 
 

 Issues with anti horde?

View previous topic View next topic Go down 
Go to page : Previous  1, 2
AuthorMessage
Barrywise
Sybarite
avatar

Posts : 419
Join date : 2012-11-13
Location : Illinois

PostSubject: Re: Issues with anti horde?   Sun Jul 30, 2017 11:50 pm

since we are in the tactics page, lets say you were forced to use your wyches to tie them up. Would you go for the smallest footprint? to minimize their swings back?

Guardsmen = O
Wyches = X

OOOOOOO
OOOOOOO
O XXXXX O
__XXXXX

^something like this, your wyches in the back can still swing, but anything past their second line, can't.

_________________
Want to chat in real time with your fellow archons? Join our Discord channel -> https://discord.gg/5yhRP7v
Back to top Go down
Azdrubael
Incubi
avatar

Posts : 1727
Join date : 2011-11-16
Location : Russia

PostSubject: Re: Issues with anti horde?   Mon Jul 31, 2017 4:18 am

Its not that anti-horde is lacking, its that Hordes got really strong with new Wound chart and lack of templates. When i met those new nurglings i was kinda surprised. Too strong for their points. They need some inherent weakness.

Hordes basically needs lots of S6. Everything else is a total waste on them.

Couple of Starweavers with Troops can do some job on them.

When i play my Scitarii, infiltrators clean up hordes. Lots of S3 shooting, lots of S6 close combat. Snipers kills character and morale finish up rest.

_________________
The Dance of Death begins - embraces, caresses, and kisses,
The Harlequin loves you as you fall over in pieces!
Back to top Go down
TeenageAngst
Hekatrix
avatar

Posts : 1321
Join date : 2016-08-28

PostSubject: Re: Issues with anti horde?   Mon Jul 31, 2017 4:35 am

Quote :
Hordes basically needs lots of S6.

Scatbikes.

_________________
Really terrible videos about tiny plastic space elfs intended to help you get gud scrub:
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCcZP8WGIhte5TmCWQXsZO4A

Flawless pieces of literary perfection:
https://www.fanfiction.net/u/2805979/
Back to top Go down
Ikol
Sybarite
avatar

Posts : 377
Join date : 2017-03-20
Location : Perth

PostSubject: Re: Issues with anti horde?   Mon Jul 31, 2017 4:55 am

TeenageAngst wrote:
Quote :
Hordes basically needs lots of S6.

Scatbikes.

Uh Uh Uh. Statistically the same number of hits as Shuriken Bikes if they move.
And Scatbikes can't shoot after Advancing.

Shuriken Bikes. But yeah.

_________________
This world exists because of the things we have done, forever branching to the decisions we make and twisting to what we do not.

Woe to our enemies. We'll tear them apart regardless.
Back to top Go down
TeenageAngst
Hekatrix
avatar

Posts : 1321
Join date : 2016-08-28

PostSubject: Re: Issues with anti horde?   Mon Jul 31, 2017 5:02 am

Don't move the scatbikes and you mulch hordes. I ate through an entire brimstone horde with them alone.

_________________
Really terrible videos about tiny plastic space elfs intended to help you get gud scrub:
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCcZP8WGIhte5TmCWQXsZO4A

Flawless pieces of literary perfection:
https://www.fanfiction.net/u/2805979/
Back to top Go down
Ikol
Sybarite
avatar

Posts : 377
Join date : 2017-03-20
Location : Perth

PostSubject: Re: Issues with anti horde?   Mon Jul 31, 2017 5:11 am

I can see that working.

How many scatbikes?

_________________
This world exists because of the things we have done, forever branching to the decisions we make and twisting to what we do not.

Woe to our enemies. We'll tear them apart regardless.
Back to top Go down
TeenageAngst
Hekatrix
avatar

Posts : 1321
Join date : 2016-08-28

PostSubject: Re: Issues with anti horde?   Mon Jul 31, 2017 5:15 am

They work best as Ynnari with Yvraine popping their soulburst every turn. I run a max squad of 9 and split their fire up as needed, usually with a warlock nearby for that -1 to be hit by return fire.

_________________
Really terrible videos about tiny plastic space elfs intended to help you get gud scrub:
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCcZP8WGIhte5TmCWQXsZO4A

Flawless pieces of literary perfection:
https://www.fanfiction.net/u/2805979/
Back to top Go down
CptMetal
Trueborn
avatar

Posts : 2650
Join date : 2015-03-03
Location : Ruhr Metropolian Area

PostSubject: Re: Issues with anti horde?   Mon Jul 31, 2017 6:30 am

I'm amazed about this issue. Aren't We dark Eldar? Used to playing warhammer on hard mode? It's not about killing them but rendering them useless. Tie them up with witches or something entirely different but more importantly: kill those officers. And if They are gone, they are nothe that threatening anymore.
And that's the challenge: how do we kill characters? Easiest way would be pathfinder or ranger but they are no true dark Eldar.

_________________
+++++INCOMING TRANSMISSION+++++
The Dark Eldar Codex sucks. You probably won just because your enemy loaded his dice to loose. Never forget this mantra and spread the word. Mention it in every discussion possible, people can´t get enough of that valuable information and need to be reminded regularely.
+++++END OF TRANSMISSION+++++
http://www.thedarkcity.net/t12720-tainted-reborn
Back to top Go down
FuelDrop
Wych
avatar

Posts : 575
Join date : 2015-06-21

PostSubject: Re: Issues with anti horde?   Mon Jul 31, 2017 6:37 am

I was always confused that DE didn't have an assassin type character. You know, a sharpshooter/melee character killer who could be deployed to take out specific priority targets. If any army should have such a unit, it would be us.

_________________
My homebrew codex is really coming along. Check it out here, and feel free to post a comment!
Back to top Go down
Painjunky
Wych
avatar

Posts : 851
Join date : 2011-08-08
Location : Sunshine Coast

PostSubject: Re: Issues with anti horde?   Mon Jul 31, 2017 6:55 am

FuelDrop wrote:
I was always confused that DE didn't have an assassin type character. You know, a sharpshooter/melee character killer who could be deployed to take out specific priority targets. If any army should have such a unit, it would be us.

Agreed.

Assassination should be our thing. Rolling Eyes
Back to top Go down
Mppqlmd
Wych
avatar

Posts : 736
Join date : 2017-07-05

PostSubject: Re: Issues with anti horde?   Mon Jul 31, 2017 6:58 am

TBH, the Archon should have access to a sniper blaster. Or the hexrifle should be D3 dmg.
Quote :
I'm amazed about this issue. Aren't We dark Eldar? Used to playing warhammer on hard mode?
This isn't hard mode. It's gorgonzola mode.

_________________
My Kabal
Back to top Go down
WildCandy
Kabalite Warrior
avatar

Posts : 145
Join date : 2016-11-06

PostSubject: Re: Issues with anti horde?   Mon Jul 31, 2017 7:04 am

Conscript blobs can 'engulf' and wrap comissars easily, but charging Conscripts from one corner you can to an extent render most of their attacks useless. Also if the opponent wants more hits he has to pile in towards you, in which case the opponent might leave an opening for you.
Also most players try to cover two units with one commissar. They can not move at the same time so if he wants to move commissar he has to leave space for him to move. This space could also be occupied by solitaire/shadowseer/troupe master with right moves and multicharge. Situational? - yes, but doable especially if the blob is already tied in combat.

I am bit unsure how the flyers guns are measured? From base or from hull, if from hull then you could maybe hang a wing over the character and measure closest model from there?

Last option would be to take wracks on Venom or Raider and give them few hexrifles and pray for good rolls, but effectivenes per point is questionable.

One more tricksy option is to give opponent only few routes to fall back, again comissar can not move at the same time, so if you wrap the conscrip blob well you could potentially force him to fall back so long that the comissar is left with relatively bad wrap or even open, if he doesn't take that option even better he is tied in combat for another round.
Back to top Go down
FuelDrop
Wych
avatar

Posts : 575
Join date : 2015-06-21

PostSubject: Re: Issues with anti horde?   Mon Jul 31, 2017 7:07 am

Painjunky wrote:
FuelDrop wrote:
I was always confused that DE didn't have an assassin type character. You know, a sharpshooter/melee character killer who could be deployed to take out specific priority targets. If any army should have such a unit, it would be us.

Agreed.

Assassination should be our thing. Rolling Eyes

Something on par with Imperial Assassins as an elites option would be nice. Either two types, one ranged with a badass sniper rifle and the option of double tapping if they don't move, and one melee monster who specializes in killing a single HQ type character quickly and effectively. Or one unit that combines both of those, maybe even a small squad (1-3) who gang up on characters. We are DE, we don't play fair after all!

_________________
My homebrew codex is really coming along. Check it out here, and feel free to post a comment!
Back to top Go down
Count Adhemar
Dark Lord of Granbretan
avatar

Posts : 6622
Join date : 2012-04-26
Location : London

PostSubject: Re: Issues with anti horde?   Mon Jul 31, 2017 7:26 am

Even something like the old rules for the Hellion Stunclaw would be superb in 8e, as you grab an important buff character and drag him away from the units he's buffing.

_________________

You have been weighed, you have been measured, and you have been found wanting. In what world could you possibly beat me?
Back to top Go down
WildCandy
Kabalite Warrior
avatar

Posts : 145
Join date : 2016-11-06

PostSubject: Re: Issues with anti horde?   Mon Jul 31, 2017 7:28 am

Count Adhemar wrote:
Even something like the old rules for the Hellion Stunclaw would be superb in 8e, as you grab an important buff character and drag him away from the units he's buffing.

Maybe we get dirty tricks Stratagem allowing such a cunning move!
Back to top Go down
aurynn
Incubi


Posts : 1531
Join date : 2013-04-23

PostSubject: Re: Issues with anti horde?   Mon Jul 31, 2017 9:01 am

DE assassins? We are raiders and pillagers... hate to say - the evil vikings of W40K. Where did you read we have any special assassins? I believe that is fantasy prejudice speaking. IMO no basis for it in W40K. But I can be wrong and will happily accept if someone can point me to some reference.
Back to top Go down
FuelDrop
Wych
avatar

Posts : 575
Join date : 2015-06-21

PostSubject: Re: Issues with anti horde?   Mon Jul 31, 2017 9:04 am

aurynn wrote:
DE assassins? We are raiders and pillagers... hate to say - the evil vikings of W40K. Where did you read we have any special assassins? I believe that is fantasy prejudice speaking. IMO no basis for it in W40K. But I can be wrong and will happily accept if someone can point me to some reference.

I figure in a society of feuding elites such as the Dark Eldar, individuals with skills at assassinating political rivals and threats covertly are a natural fit. I find your views on the Dark Eldar very interesting by the way.

_________________
My homebrew codex is really coming along. Check it out here, and feel free to post a comment!
Back to top Go down
Mppqlmd
Wych
avatar

Posts : 736
Join date : 2017-07-05

PostSubject: Re: Issues with anti horde?   Mon Jul 31, 2017 9:08 am

Mandrakes alone are already supposed to be assassins. The whole "upset the Archon and you'll end up struggled by our own shadow" feels very assassinesque (because that's totally a word) to me.
So it could be nice to have the sniper rule on mandrakes...

_________________
My Kabal
Back to top Go down
|Meavar
Wych
avatar

Posts : 536
Join date : 2017-01-26

PostSubject: Re: Issues with anti horde?   Mon Jul 31, 2017 9:09 am

Mandrakes hired to kill, archons having to stave of assasins from everyone all the time:

Though every Archon is a conceited, solipsistic megalomaniac convinced of his mental and physical superiority over all other beings, he will retain his position as an overlord of Commorragh for only as long as he can stave off the endless coup and assassination attempts of his rivals, enemies and his own Dracon lieutenants.

Seems like we use assasins very often since our archons have to stave of endless assasination attempts.
Back to top Go down
aurynn
Incubi


Posts : 1531
Join date : 2013-04-23

PostSubject: Re: Issues with anti horde?   Mon Jul 31, 2017 9:33 am

FuelDrop wrote:
aurynn wrote:
DE assassins? We are raiders and pillagers... hate to say - the evil vikings of W40K. Where did you read we have any special assassins? I believe that is fantasy prejudice speaking. IMO no basis for it in W40K. But I can be wrong and will happily accept if someone can point me to some reference.

I figure in a society of feuding elites such as the Dark Eldar, individuals with skills at assassinating political rivals and threats covertly are a natural fit. I find your views on the Dark Eldar very interesting by the way.

Thank you. And I like if people challenge those views of mine with their own like you do. Its enriching. :-)

Yea. It does sound like a natural thing, but I think they are beyond that. There are no snipers shooting Archons through open windows... they usually make their tricks much more sinister. Betrayals and traps and such...
Back to top Go down
|Meavar
Wych
avatar

Posts : 536
Join date : 2017-01-26

PostSubject: Re: Issues with anti horde?   Mon Jul 31, 2017 9:57 am

That I agree with. I would much rather see an melee variant then a normal sniper.
But that does not mean we should not get an assasin like option. Something that has a way of targetting enemy characters despite blobs surrounding them.
Back to top Go down
Azdrubael
Incubi
avatar

Posts : 1727
Join date : 2011-11-16
Location : Russia

PostSubject: Re: Issues with anti horde?   Mon Jul 31, 2017 10:17 am

Why not just take Solitaire? He is an assassin alright. S5 -2, lots of atacks, crazy good movement, can hop through units. The very definition of assassin. Dont like the estetics - convert him.

He is practically Altair of 40k, looking just like him and probably entire model estetic has been taken from Assassin Creed.

_________________
The Dance of Death begins - embraces, caresses, and kisses,
The Harlequin loves you as you fall over in pieces!


Last edited by Azdrubael on Mon Jul 31, 2017 10:18 am; edited 1 time in total
Back to top Go down
aurynn
Incubi


Posts : 1531
Join date : 2013-04-23

PostSubject: Re: Issues with anti horde?   Mon Jul 31, 2017 10:18 am

I like the idea of mandrakes striking from shadows... Would not solve anything probably though since they would need to fit  and smart player wont let even single model fit near his critical character. Shooting with option to target characters is the only reliable way of hitting a character. We will have to get used to that we cannot remove a force multiplier character of an army that is reliant on it. Although it makes snipers somewhat meh...

Solitaire is certainly great in that role. But again - he has to fit near his target...
Back to top Go down
 
Issues with anti horde?
View previous topic View next topic Back to top 
Page 2 of 2Go to page : Previous  1, 2

Permissions in this forum:You cannot reply to topics in this forum
THE DARK CITY :: 

COMMORRAGH TACTICA

 :: Dark Eldar Tactics
-
Jump to: