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 Best Aeldari AI

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lcfr
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PostSubject: Best Aeldari AI   Mon Jul 24 2017, 14:31

Is massed Splinter fire the most efficient means of dealing with infantry blobs that we have access to?

I'm looking at other Aeldari options and Craftworld just seems very short ranged or too expensive for what they're bringing to the table.
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Count Adhemar
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PostSubject: Re: Best Aeldari AI   Mon Jul 24 2017, 14:44

Given that most infantry that can blob in any meaningful way are T3 (or less), sadly, Splinter weaponry is pretty terrible against them. You're essentially firing the equivalent of a S2 gun! I've not done the mathhammer on it but I suspect the answer will probably have the word "Shuriken" somewhere in it.

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CptMetal
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PostSubject: Re: Best Aeldari AI   Mon Jul 24 2017, 14:53

@Count Adhemar wrote:
Given that most infantry that can blob in any meaningful way are T3 (or less), sadly, Splinter weaponry is pretty terrible against them. You're essentially firing the equivalent of a S2 gun! I've not done the mathhammer on it but I suspect the answer will probably have the word "Shuriken" somewhere in it.

S2 gun? More like S3 gun against most blobs.
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Count Adhemar
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PostSubject: Re: Best Aeldari AI   Mon Jul 24 2017, 14:59

Oops, typo alert. Yes, S3 is indeed correct.

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|Meavar
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PostSubject: Re: Best Aeldari AI   Mon Jul 24 2017, 15:03

So we have the equavalent of imperial guard with a +1 to hit but no support (no double shots, no fallback and shoot, no increase in saves, no extra attacks)
And while we might be better against living things with higher thoughness, we are worse against light vehicles.
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lcfr
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PostSubject: Re: Best Aeldari AI   Mon Jul 24 2017, 15:29

I'm eating vehicles and multiwound models for breakfast, lunch and dinner, honestly.

My beef with Shuriken weapons is that I need to get to within a Lasgun's Rapid Fire range in order to do anything with them in bulk, and trading Shuriken fire for Las fire is a sure way for my unit to die.

I don't think the rate of fire on Shuriken Cannons on vehicles is high enough either. Are Scatter Lasers the way? Do I need Nightspinners or heavy weapon teams with the Aeldari mortar equivalent? Because I know that pointing Aeldari infantry wielding Shuriken weapons at infantry blobs will just be a sad, sad joke.

The Splinter fire is working really well against MEQ since they're not in great numbers, but the fact that Guard are laughing in my face even though I can remember a day when an Archon could chew through platoons is just painful.
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Count Adhemar
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PostSubject: Re: Best Aeldari AI   Mon Jul 24 2017, 15:38

@lcfr wrote:
I'm eating vehicles and multiwound models for breakfast, lunch and dinner, honestly

At 27 splinter shots to inflict a single wound against a vehicle (assuming 3+ save) I find that a bit hard to believe.

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lcfr
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PostSubject: Re: Best Aeldari AI   Mon Jul 24 2017, 15:50

Oh my goodness no not with Splinter fire ! I just mean my army has the tools to deal with vehicles and multi wound models.
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attackdrone
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PostSubject: Re: Best Aeldari AI   Mon Jul 24 2017, 16:44

I've had a lot of luck with massed Splinter Fire shooting at second row / third row infantry targets while I bring in Wyches, Bloodbrides, Incubi, and Clawed Fiends to deal with the first row infantry. I find either by themselves to be somewhat lacking, however.
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RedRegicide
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PostSubject: Re: Best Aeldari AI   Mon Jul 24 2017, 16:55

^ this

I haven't beaten guard yet, but I think the key is massive numbers of melee attacks. Leaving wyches as a good option. Suddenly wyches are hitting on 2s, re rolling 1s, wounding on 4s and can use pistols to shoot them. They don't have many pistols and they only have a 50/50 of escaping, plus they have to use an order to shoot so they can't use the double tap order.

Wyches multi charge after raider eats over watch, that way if he retreats, hopefully one of the units fails their escape roll and we have meat shields

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PostSubject: Re: Best Aeldari AI   Mon Jul 24 2017, 18:36

I still find grots to be very effective at killing infantry, with a haemy against str 3 blobs need 6s to wound the grots. Granted most armys have tools to remove grots but those same tools are needed to kill our vehicles.

Biggest issue by far though is the loss of whole models when you roll a 1, when a transport dies.

I also use a unit or 2 of harlies with a troupe master (unit I can get my hands on some incubi models that aren't utter crap, I really really hope that GW is making a better version, the model is beautiful when the swords aren't bent and full of bubbles etc. but so far only 1 in 10 have been even worth gluing together).

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attackdrone
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PostSubject: Re: Best Aeldari AI   Mon Jul 24 2017, 19:26

@Seshiru wrote:
Biggest issue by far though is the loss of whole models when you roll a 1, when a transport dies.

I work around this by using Wyches/Bloodbrides in packs of 5 or 10 (depending on Venom vs Raider). The only models that matter are those with Hydra Gauntlets and the Hekatrix/Syren. The rest are ablative wounds.
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Kantalla
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PostSubject: Re: Best Aeldari AI   Mon Jul 24 2017, 22:32

If you are looking at Craftworlds then Dark Reapers with a Tempest Launcher are a good option, which work against a good range of targets.

Shining Spears can also put out an impressive amount of damage, albeit at very short range. Their shooting is almost as points efficient as Dark Reapers from <6", plus they can do some damage in assault too.

Scatter Laser Windriders are still fairly effective, but aren't in as good a place as they once were (which is probably fair enough), as they can no longer move without penalty and don't have the pop back behind cover option.

All of those options are a bit of the glass cannon choice, compared to Warriors in Raider or Venom, but will put out a lot more damage for the same points.

If you are specifically looking at Conscripts spam then dealing with the buff characters becomes quite important, and Rangers become tempting to get rid of the Commissar.

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mightydoughnut
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PostSubject: Re: Best Aeldari AI   Mon Jul 24 2017, 23:13

Necrotoxin missiles look promising, hell most of the missiles can drop some hurt on GEQ infantry. They are just a support weapon in my opinion tho, taking Razorwings just to counter light infantry is kind of a point waste. CC is by far the most reliable, but there are some ways to chip away at them.

Maybe 10 Medusae in a Raider? That's 40 S4 -2AP shots at a small price of around 400 points. Very Happy

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PostSubject: Re: Best Aeldari AI   Mon Jul 24 2017, 23:20

@mightydoughnut wrote:
Necrotoxin missiles look promising, hell most of the missiles can drop some hurt on GEQ infantry. They are just a support weapon in my opinion tho, taking Razorwings just to counter light infantry is kind of a point waste. CC is by far the most reliable, but there are some ways to chip away at them.

Maybe 10 Medusae in a Raider? That's 40 S4 -2AP shots at a small price of around 400 points. Very Happy
With the new FAQ making Necrotoxin D6 assault, Shatterfield is far better, especially against GEQ (wounding on 2+ rerollable FTW).
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dumpeal
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PostSubject: Re: Best Aeldari AI   Tue Jul 25 2017, 01:11

for a huge 1-unit blob, void mine
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lcfr
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PostSubject: Re: Best Aeldari AI   Tue Jul 25 2017, 01:29

Void Mine only hits up to 10 models and is a huge waste against guard imo.

I'm up to try Wyches I guess but I just can't believe that this is what it's come to.
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Barrywise
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PostSubject: Re: Best Aeldari AI   Tue Jul 25 2017, 03:14

Assuming you're able to use a raider to absorb overwatch, is a wych worth her points in melee against guard? I feel like if the opponent has truly massive Conscript spam she might just be worth it. They're only able to hit back with 2 rows of models right?

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PostSubject: Re: Best Aeldari AI   Tue Jul 25 2017, 05:59

@lcfr wrote:
Is massed Splinter fire the most efficient means of dealing with infantry blobs that we have access to?

I'm looking at other Aeldari options and Craftworld just seems very short ranged or too expensive for what they're bringing to the table.

Splinter + CC.

Rapid fire the crap out of them then charge them with everything... raiders, venoms, wyches, incubi, warriors, reavers, wracks, talos, hellions, its all good.

If you can manager it a T6 raider or grots (from a heams +1T bubble) or talos will tank all the S3 overwatch like it's nothing.
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|Meavar
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PostSubject: Re: Best Aeldari AI   Tue Jul 25 2017, 07:44

@Barrywise wrote:
Assuming you're able to use a raider to absorb overwatch, is a wych worth her points in melee against guard? I feel like if the opponent has truly massive Conscript spam she might just be worth it. They're only able to hit back with 2 rows of models right?

If done right you can get 3 probably even 4 rows.
Everything within 1 inch is in combat (which is 2 rows if you put them as a closely packed as possible). And then everything within 1 inch of those models (which means again roughly 2 rows) in practice it will probably be closer to 3 rows since a combat is rarely as neatly allighned as that.
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Mppqlmd
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PostSubject: Re: Best Aeldari AI   Tue Jul 25 2017, 10:45

I'm surprized noone mentionned harlequins for the best cc AI in the Aeldari faction.
4 attacks hitting on 3+ wounding on 3+ (with access to reroll) and -3 AP for 21sh points, they are basically incubi that lose PFP and 3+ to gain 1 attack, 4+ invulnerable, a pistol, holo suits and rising crescendo (and access to the infamous "shield from harm"). Unleashing them on guards is nuts. And you can even fall back through the unit you are in melee with, to charge a unit behind. You can't stop a squad of harlies. Unless you kill them ofc ^^

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masamune
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PostSubject: Re: Best Aeldari AI   Tue Jul 25 2017, 11:41

I'd suggest you go for melee.

As said before, wyches & bloodbrides are pretty effective lawn mowers against low infantry, especially with hydra gauntlets.

You can also orient towards beasts (claw fiends, khymerae) or even Archon suite ur-ghuls (don't buy them, but equivalents like warhammer crypt ghouls).

Looking at other aeldaries, harlies are great at cac whatsoever.
Eldars, consider having a look at banshees or scorpions.

Might be a little more expansive point wise though..

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dumpeal
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PostSubject: Re: Best Aeldari AI   Tue Jul 25 2017, 14:27

@lcfr wrote:
Void Mine only hits up to 10 models and is a huge waste against guard imo.

I'm up to try Wyches I guess but I just can't believe that this is what it's come to.

Damned. I didn't see the max 10 model. You're right.
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lcfr
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PostSubject: Re: Best Aeldari AI   Tue Jul 25 2017, 14:41

I drafted up a 2k Ynnari list composed of a Battalion, Air Wing and Vanguard detachment, the Vanguard is pretty much there to deal with hordes: two units of Incubi and a unit of Bloodbrides and a Succubus.

I think Harlies are better but I don't have the models and I don't think giving up Rising Crescendo for SfD is a great trade.

We'll see how it goes!
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PostSubject: Re: Best Aeldari AI   Tue Jul 25 2017, 15:10

2 units of Incubi and a unit of Bloodbrides isn't enough. They will kill a few, the blob will likely walk out of combat and your T3 squishies will get shot off the table by pretty much anything with a pea shooter or stronger.
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