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 2000pt Pure DE

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SCP Yeeman
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PostSubject: 2000pt Pure DE    Mon Jul 17 2017, 21:12

Here is the list I have been running the last 7 games. I just won an 18 person RTT with it this past weekend. I have not lost yet in 8th in my 10 games and am still looking to make some changes if I am missing something in the list.

Battalion
Haemonculus, Whip, Crucible
Haemonculus, Whip, Crucible

x3 Grotesques, x1 Whip
x3 Grotesques, x1 Whip
x5 Mandrakes
x5 Mandrakes
x5 Mandrakes

x5 Wracks, x1 Whip, x2 Liquifyer Guns
x5 Warriors, Blaster, Blast Pistol
x5 Warriors, Blaster, Blast Pistol

Ravager, x3 Lances, Prow
Ravager, x3 Lances, Prow

Razorwing Fighter, x2 Lances, Rifle
Razorwing Fighter, x2 Lances, Rifle

Venom, x1 SC, x1 Rifle
Venom, x1 SC, x1 Rifle
Venom, x1 SC, x1 Rifle
Raider, Lance, Prow
Raider, Lance, Prow

It has been highly effective because I have a nice balance of everything. Plenty of Lances to deal with high Toughness, units to lock up and win in CC, and plenty of poison and AI to deal with hordes and mass infantry.
The Haemons go with the Grotesques. The Wracks usually follow one of them to make a harder push to one side. I get my Venoms and Warriors in the fray as quick as possible to take advantage of the 10 shots max on the Venoms. My fliers and Ravagers do their thing by shooting things that need it. With the different weaponry on the Razorwings, I like taking advantage of shooting usually at 3 different targets.
The Mandrakes have been nothing short of gold this edition. I usually keep them out until Turn 2 (unless I absolutely need their firepower T1) so they can reroll charges and give my opponent at least 1 turn of moving up and opening up holes in their backfield for them to fit. Their 10 shots hitting on 3's and usually wounding everything on a 5+ at the least with Mortal wounds have been great. Getting the Mortal Wound on a 6+ and another wound is very very good. In assault, they are not the best, but they throw out 16 attacks at str. 4 and that isnt something to just shake your head at. If its turn 3, they hit on 2s which means they are throwing wounds on normal dudes quite effectively! My opponents usually cannot afford to pay them heed as I have my 3 CC units and the Ravagers/Fliers buzzing around. When they realize they have no save and can be taken out easily with some Bolters, they get after them. Against massive flier lists (which seems to be the meta right now) I have heald them back until T3 and just infilitrated them on my opponent's backfield objectives and the fliers usually do not have the maneuverability to get back there before they themselves die or the game is over. They have undoubtedly been my MVP thus far in 8th.

I would like to answer any questions or criticisms on the list.
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dumpeal
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PostSubject: Re: 2000pt Pure DE    Mon Jul 17 2017, 23:39

How does your grotesques are doing in this edition? I feel they are a lot more vulnerable, now. More wrack instead would not be better?
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SCP Yeeman
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PostSubject: Re: 2000pt Pure DE    Tue Jul 18 2017, 00:15

They are hit or miss on dmg output to be honest. I like that they have flexibility where they can str. 5 ap -1 and wounds T4 things on 3s or use the Flesh Gauntlet for Mortal Wounds or tougher targets. They big issue is the AP and actual dmg. With little to no ap on their weapons you are at the mercy of rolling 6s or your opponent failing saves. Just yesterday, it took 6 rounds of CC for my Grotesques and Haemon to kill 10 basic CSM.
However, they are hard to kill being T6 with 3 wounds. Honestly I have had more die from just vehicle explosions (with a reroll even) than people D3 or D6-ing them out. They live and have potential for lots of wounds and force saves. Remember Turn 2 they reroll charges, and should get there, turn 3 they will put out 15 attacks hitting on 2s, so the potential is there. At the very least they hold things in CC and will lock units in with them with little dmg taken in return. They are not CC beasts, but they perform admirably at times.
Surprisingly the 5++ Invuln and the 6+++ is rather nice to keep guys going. Also, what is huge with them is the ability to eat Overwatch from heavy targets like Storm Ravens (if in Hover) and other highly potent tanks that put out loads of Dakka.
As for Wracks, I like them for the Liquifyers and the sometime T5 if I can get them with a Haemon. They put out decent attacks and are cheap but the T6 vs T4/5 of Wracks is no comparison. I think if you want to run Wracks, you'll want/need the Haemon with them and that begins to cost more points as you have a Haemon for each Wrack squad. Plus, morale can become an issue as well. Grotesques will never test losing only 1 model at 3 per squad which I feel is the sweet spot.
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colinsherlow
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PostSubject: Re: 2000pt Pure DE    Fri Jul 21 2017, 22:06

Your list looks fun.

I have tried the Grots a few times in 8th. They are pretty much exactly as you said. I have really been wanting to try out 3 or 4 Talos in my army. They have a different roll then the Grots, but I think the Talos is a oittle more versatile. I like the idea of having 4 Talos w/twin splinter cannons and macro scalpel seems pretty good to me. And being able to pump out 48 poision shots sounds good as well. I can't wait to try them out.

How has this list faired for you? You thinking of making any changes?

Also glad to hear that mandrakes are working out so well. I have only used 1 unit so far, but I was quite impressed with them. I always consider taking a few units when writing a list, unless I have something very specific in mind

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SCP Yeeman
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PostSubject: Re: 2000pt Pure DE    Fri Jul 21 2017, 22:21

This list has done very well for me. My hardest game of 8th thus far has been against 6 Nurgle Princes and 12 Blight Drones and Typhus w/ Walkers. I like that I have fast elements in the fliers that can knock out any target and have plenty of shooting to back up the CC. I have never been a fan of the extreme lists you can make because it is too easy to counter them.

I have played a few games since posting this and I think I want to swap a Haemonculus and Grotesques out for a squad of Incubi. I like the AP-3 on them and the 3+ save. The Archon's LD buff has been nice with them as well as his 2++. I also knocked the Wracks out in favor of more Warriors as I like the extra Blaster shots and the Wracks really not accomplishing much.

Talos huh? They feel so weak in CC, which is sad. Only Strength and T 6 makes them not the best. I know the Haemon can help with the Toughness, but their weapons lack good AP values too which is a shame because they should be ripping units apart. Their shooting is nice and can be surprising I imagine. I think Cannons are the way to go as it keep them cheap. How would you back them up? Ravagers and Razorwings? I like the idea of running Talos if you run a lot of them and really just center your army around them. I just worry you will not get too much bang for your buck. But I should sit down and see whats what before rushing to judgement.
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colinsherlow
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PostSubject: Re: 2000pt Pure DE    Sat Jul 22 2017, 01:04

I agree with you about Wracks. They seem pretty good, but warriors are always useful.

I have yet to try Incubi, but I am itching to try them out. The -3ap is really nice in CC would be really nice to have.
I have been taking disintegrators on either my Raiders or Razorwings to get to get a higher rate of fire and deal with TEQ/MEQ. At first I was really on the fence about them, and was not sure why they cost more than dark lances. I jave come to see the light....dark light that is. But taking at least 3 or 4 disintegrators and lots dark lances has been really nice. Disintegrators have been pretty good against armour as well.

Talos are not super kill everything in combat gods or anything. And I would like to see maybe a -2 or -3ap weapon on them. But each Talos having 6 attacks with -1ap and 2dmg has been pretty good. Especially with PfP helping them charge and fight. And the 6+fnpis quite nice along side their saves.

But yeah with Talos you kind of want your army built around getting them into cc and to be a good counter assault unit. They can get quite a lot of work done. If you wright your list well your opponent won't be able to concentrate fire on them that often because there are higher priority targets out there like Ravagers and Razorwings.
I think if you write a list with Talos you probably want at least 3 or 4. I would opt for 4 or 5 if possible.

I am thinking of taking mostly pure Drukhari, but might take a little psychic support in the form of a Farseer for Doom.  Having access to Doom for dark eldar is amazing. It really makes our posion and Lance weapons shine. And the Talos re-rolling wounds via shooting or cc can be devastating. 48cannons shots followed by charging Talos unit will kill a lot of crap. Talos not having degrading stats as they take damage is really nice as well.

Right now I am debating on taking either the Yncarne or multiple Talos. Or both. But I think that could be getting a little too extreme.


For a Talos list I thinking of this for a base.

Farseer
Haemonculus

4 Talos
2 ravagers w/lances
2 Razorwings build however

1 or 2 units of Razorwing flocks + beast master

Fill list with kabalites and/or Trueborn in gunboats.

It is worth tying out for sure.
I am hoping to get a few games in soon. Just busy with family and summer atm


EDIT:

Just a quick example list. I haven't put a ton of thought into this list, but I will win games
It would probably change a bunch after play testing.

Farseer
Haemonculus w/ crucible, whip

2x5 kabalites

Beastmaster
2x10 Razorwing flocks

2x5 Scourges

2 Ravagers w/ lances

2x2 Talos w/ 2 Splinter Cannons and 2 Marco scalpel

2 Razorwing Jetfighters w/ disintegrators

2x Raiders w/ lances

Exactly 2k

I could easily drop the scourges to increase the size of the kabalite units and give them cannons and a blaster.
Or even drop 1 scourge unit and load the other up with blasters for more AT. Which is never a bad thing.

I have come to really love Razorwing flocks. I like taking 2 units. They stop first turn assault, mess of DS armies. Tie units up, clog up the field etc. They are very useful and have won me games because my opponent could close the distance or they get toed up in cc. So good!

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lcfr
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PostSubject: Re: 2000pt Pure DE    Sat Jul 22 2017, 02:11

Out of curiosity, how do you keep your Grotesques IN combat?

Like how did you lock up 10 CSM for so many rounds without them just falling back and having the surrounding units obliterate them ? That's my issue. I'm playing against shooty lists and there's always enough firepower to spare against them once they're disembarked and in threat range.
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SCP Yeeman
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PostSubject: Re: 2000pt Pure DE    Sat Jul 22 2017, 03:40

I like the look of the list. Do you think going solo squads of Talos would be better so you do not have to worry about Mortal Wounds spilling over? I also need to make some more Flocks. I still have 6 from my old Beastpack in 5th and 6th but need to spend some time sittign down and building more of them. They seem like great screening units and with their speed able to tie up parking lots and assault fliers!

To be honest I should have fallen back and just shot the CSM but I was winning rather handily and figured I did not need to.
I have not had many people fall back out of CC with the Grotesques because they are always firing at my  other targets like Ravagers, Venoms, or Fliers.  They definitely can be gunned down but with T6 and a 5++/6+ they do absorb some nice firepower.  The thing that gets them the most is Smite.
The hard hitting units that could easily take out things like Grotesques are the very things I tend to charge with them or other units like my vehicles to prevent their shooting for more than one turn.  It is rare if I am not in CC Turn 2 with the Grotesques because they get to move 14'' T1 then with disembark move another 10'' and reroll charges.
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colinsherlow
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PostSubject: Re: 2000pt Pure DE    Sat Jul 22 2017, 04:36

Yeah I own 6 GW flocks. But then I found the Zombaside murder of crows on Amazon for $30.00CAD. Which is great. They are just about the right size as well.

As for the Talos. I like units of 2, but I can easily see taking them solo.

Flocks have been a really good unit for Drukhari. The more I play them the better I get at using them. They help the list out a tone. 20 flocks and a beast master costs 200points.

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sumguy777
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PostSubject: Re: 2000pt Pure DE    Sat Jul 22 2017, 05:29

i 2nd the flocks very good and under rated squad for sure.
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