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 King of spam, 21 CP's, discuss

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amishprn86
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PostSubject: King of spam, 21 CP's, discuss   Fri Jul 07 2017, 16:30

I know this is a "list" but its more so talking about the potential and theory craft of these styles of lists and not necessary this list in general.


I want to talk about Lists in 8th, there are a few things now that change the game a bit, CP's, Lack of AP on basic weapons, cover is +1 armor and for DE PFP.

With the Idea of model spam (Daemons with Nurgle spam, or DE/Nids/Necrons with Swarm spam etc..) being a little stronger than most players would have thought combine with the ability to have cheap troops for CP's. We are starting to see a trend.

So here is a theory craft list (As cheap as i could to get the most CP's i could)

1541pts, 2 Brigades and 1 Battalion, 21 CP's

Click me to see the list:
 

As you can see its not very strong, but its 102 models, with 162 wounds for 1541pts. There are MUCH amounts of poison with 12 Shurikens and 8 Smite Attempts on 1 dice each, along with the Medusae weapons.

Honestly not to strong, but you can easily add more Flocks, so vehicles and even Beastmasters for the flocks, you can add more of anything you want, even 2 fliers can easily fit with something else. nearly 450ptspts can fit alot, you can even fit 5 venoms even (tho i wouldnt do that lol, its just to point out what 450ptspts can get you).

How do you feel a bout these style lists? Would you play them? OD you like? Whats your opinions on the Matter?

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Myrvn
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PostSubject: Re: King of spam, 21 CP's, discuss   Fri Jul 07 2017, 17:28

I'd like to run Ynnari against it....
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attackdrone
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PostSubject: Re: King of spam, 21 CP's, discuss   Fri Jul 07 2017, 17:28

For one, you'll always be going second. Also with that many minimum squad units, you'll always be giving up first blood.

I think this sort of list will get better as we get more abilities to use command points on.

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amishprn86
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PostSubject: Re: King of spam, 21 CP's, discuss   Fri Jul 07 2017, 17:41

attackdrone wrote:
For one, you'll always be going second. Also with that many minimum squad units, you'll always be giving up first blood.

I think this sort of list will get better as we get more abilities to use command points on.


Just a reminder not this list in general, but lists like these.

Yes you'll go 2nd or if ITC a 16.67% higher chance to go 2nd. IMO Command points are good but htey are not the end all be all, the other part about these style lists is the "win by spamming crap"

For 450pts more you can add 64 more Razorwing flocks, giving you another 256 wounds to eat through, with 21 CP's you can spend 2 per turn to not take Moral, you can spend to re-roll Charges, you can spend etc...

Its just the concept of spam crap to win, this is taking it to a different level.

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krayd
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PostSubject: Re: King of spam, 21 CP's, discuss   Fri Jul 07 2017, 18:38

amishprn86 wrote:

For 450pts more you can add 64 more Razorwing flocks, giving you another 256 wounds to eat through, with 21 CP's you can spend 2 per turn to not take Moral, you can spend to re-roll Charges, you can spend etc...

Its just the concept of spam crap to win, this is taking it to a different level.

Remember, you can't use the same strategem more than once per phase, so you'll be able to reroll *one* charge per turn, you'll be able to auto-pass *one* morale check per turn, etc. So, if your opponent spreads their wounds around, they can pretty easily force you to make a LOT of morale checks.

Of course, the upside to that is, if you pass the first morale check on any given unit, you probably won't have to worry about morale for the rest of the game, because once your model count per unit hits a certain threshold, they're effectively immune to morale, even without Turn 4 PfP (they just die off more easily, due to low model count instead!).
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amishprn86
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PostSubject: Re: King of spam, 21 CP's, discuss   Fri Jul 07 2017, 19:06

You can use the same stratagems once per phase, Movement, Psychic, Shooting, CC etc.. so thats a few re-rolls there and you can use to past your Moral every turn, its not limited once.

But being 5man units and 1 man units, warriors Syberite are LD 8, you would have to lose 3 to fail for 1 guy to die. SO im not to concern about moral at all.

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RedRegicide
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PostSubject: Re: King of spam, 21 CP's, discuss   Fri Jul 07 2017, 19:13

I think anything taken to be extreme is detrimental. I do however agree that CPs can be very useful. Most maelstroms have the ability to discard mission cards via points right?

What about: 2 brigades

6 archon = 360 ish
6 ravager = 930
12 kabalites = 420
2 medusa = 56
Beast master = 56
3 small flocks

Has more anti armour, and lots of kabalites for holding objectives

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Bakerloch
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PostSubject: Re: King of spam, 21 CP's, discuss   Tue Jul 11 2017, 19:53

Where is anyone seeing a cap on command stratagems per phase? I'm looking at page 242 of rulebook. The closest thing it says is "unless otherwise stated, you can use the same stratagem multiple times during the course of a battle"
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dumpeal
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PostSubject: Re: King of spam, 21 CP's, discuss   Tue Jul 11 2017, 20:38

It doesn't really matter for now, but having Eldars in your army will make it a Aeldari army and not a Drukhari army.

When the stratagems list per faction will come out, it will matter. This will probably prevent you from using the most specialised ones.
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amishprn86
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PostSubject: Re: King of spam, 21 CP's, discuss   Tue Jul 11 2017, 20:58

Pg215

"The same stratagem cannot be used by the same player more than once during any phase"

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