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 The Role of DE Beasts in 8th

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Sess
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PostSubject: Re: The Role of DE Beasts in 8th   Sat Jun 10 2017, 03:30

I'm actually not sure how good beast units are in 8th though. The beasts themselves don't seem too bad, but holy cow the beastmaster himself costs more than an archon! And he comes with a lot less too.

Just taking like a single clawed fiend with no bestmaster might be decent though. It's like a faster single grotesque that doesn't need a transport. A single model won't have to worry about morale.

I actually question the birds though, they seem decent but the beastmaster seems pretty weak which may make them less useful. If you don't take a beastmaster then it would be pretty easy to lose multiple bases of birds to morale checks.

Khymerae might also work without a beastmaster in the minimum squad size so you don't have to worry about them failing morale too much. If they would have to take morale they are probably already dead anyways.

I think using beast units without beastmasters may be good, but mainly just in the very minimum unit size to limit how much a bad morale roll could affect you. For less than cost of 1 beastmaster you could also have 5 wyches with an agonizer and a wych weapon.
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Cerve
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PostSubject: Re: The Role of DE Beasts in 8th   Sat Jun 10 2017, 09:46

Sess wrote:
I'm actually not sure how good beast units are in 8th though. The beasts themselves don't seem too bad, but holy cow the beastmaster himself costs more than an archon! And he comes with a lot less too.

Just taking like a single clawed fiend with no bestmaster might be decent though. It's like a faster single grotesque that doesn't need a transport. A single model won't have to worry about morale.

I actually question the birds though, they seem decent but the beastmaster seems pretty weak which may make them less useful. If you don't take a beastmaster then it would be pretty easy to lose multiple bases of birds to morale checks.

Khymerae might also work without a beastmaster in the minimum squad size so you don't have to worry about them failing morale too much. If they would have to take morale they are probably already dead anyways.

I think using beast units without beastmasters may be good, but mainly just in the very minimum unit size to limit how much a bad morale roll could affect you. For less than cost of 1 beastmaster you could also have 5 wyches with an agonizer and a wych weapon.



Beastmaster cost so much for the not-targetable hero rule. Plus he lost the 2+ + but he get pod and the reroll to hit for all the beasts within 6 (as the morale as well).

And you can build him a but. But first of all, it drags FA Beasts into Elites one, just in case you wanna more free FA slots.

He's not bad at all for me
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amishprn86
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PostSubject: Re: The Role of DE Beasts in 8th   Sat Jun 10 2017, 18:50

The Beastmaster never had 2+, he always been a 5+ (Hellion stats) with better attacks and an adiditon weapon to pick.

For me having a Beastmaster for 60pts is fine, just need 1 to stay within the bubble you dont need more than one.

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RoadRageRob666
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PostSubject: Re: The Role of DE Beasts in 8th   Sun Jun 11 2017, 00:50

So I guess our Razerwing Flock (RWF) spam list would look something like this:

2x Outrider Detachments each with:

F.A: 6 x 12 units of RWF
Elite: 2 x 1 Beastmasters w/ Ag + 2 x 12 units of RWF
HQ: 1x Succubus w/ Blast pistol

1x Vangaurd Detchment with:

Elites: 3x Beastmaste w/ Ag
HQ: 1x Succubus

Total: 2000pts

192 RWF bases, 7 Beastmasters to spread the Ld and re-roll Auras and 3x Succubus to open up some more drug options and throw around some Ap-3 and -4 attacks (also re-rolls for beastmaster... not that youd want them in combat).

If I lived on the west coast of the continent, I would 100% bring this to LVO just to troll the try-hards and have some laughs.

"Oh, thats a very nice, balanced, well thought out Ad Mech/Sisters list that you have! A lot of planning and play testing must have gone into that!"

"...... Did you seriously bring 192 fking RWFs? What the hell do those even do?"

Do you think Id get bonus points for dressing like the crow and having casual cawing conversations?
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TeenageAngst
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PostSubject: Re: The Role of DE Beasts in 8th   Sun Jun 11 2017, 00:51

If I run this list I'm bringing a small speaker that just plays Surfin' Bird on loop the entire game.

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CptMetal
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PostSubject: Re: The Role of DE Beasts in 8th   Sun Jun 11 2017, 07:10

Problem is when they got snipers.
They kill the beast masters and every damage on a bird squad drags more down due to morale.

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Scrz
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PostSubject: Re: The Role of DE Beasts in 8th   Sun Jun 11 2017, 09:08

Yeah, the beastmaster will die immediately if someone brings snipers. But if you stock up on command points you can auto pass that morale roll for a couple of turns at least.
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amishprn86
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PostSubject: Re: The Role of DE Beasts in 8th   Sun Jun 11 2017, 11:56

I can see all SM using the Sniper Assassin... 2+ to hit, no saves at all.

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Archon_91
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PostSubject: Re: The Role of DE Beasts in 8th   Sun Jun 11 2017, 15:16

Except our 6+++ fnp would allow saves against it, did my first 8th edition game yesterday against a dark angles biker gang list and the 6+++ saved my wyches from dying to plasma enough times to frustrate my opponent ... and keep most of the unit alive to charge his bikes
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PostSubject: Re: The Role of DE Beasts in 8th   Sun Jun 11 2017, 15:30

did you win?

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Archon_91
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PostSubject: Re: The Role of DE Beasts in 8th   Sun Jun 11 2017, 15:38

I lost fewer models then he did (1 cronos,1 venom, 4 wyches, 1 jetfighter, 1 razorwing flock, and 3 kymaera, to his losing a land speeder and 20 bikes) and I wouldn't say there was a win or lose to the game, it only lasted 2 turns as my opponent had to leave after that due to how late it was getting but I could put a report of the game in the tactics or discussion session if you would like
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TeenageAngst
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PostSubject: Re: The Role of DE Beasts in 8th   Mon Jun 12 2017, 01:08

So this is deployment.



This was balanced.

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RedRegicide
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PostSubject: Re: The Role of DE Beasts in 8th   Mon Jun 12 2017, 01:14

Hahahah did you actually play with them already? What are he non-birds

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Sslyth
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PostSubject: Re: The Role of DE Beasts in 8th   Mon Jun 12 2017, 01:17

I'd love to hear how:

1. that list actually fares in a real game
2. how you got your hands on 200 razorwing flocks

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amishprn86
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PostSubject: Re: The Role of DE Beasts in 8th   Mon Jun 12 2017, 01:20

https://www.amazon.com/CMON-GUG0063-Zombicide-Murder-Crowz/dp/B00WKTTCW6

its almost 1$ per base.

I bought 2 boxes to test, it says it will be here by the next hour but most likely will be here tomorrow.

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Dread Serpent
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PostSubject: Re: The Role of DE Beasts in 8th   Mon Jun 12 2017, 02:08

I feel like this idea would work better for Ynnari. Yncarne gives the birds immunity to moral and if they kill birds the Yncarne can heal up.
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PostSubject: Re: The Role of DE Beasts in 8th   Mon Jun 12 2017, 02:10

Here's how it works:

You make the birds Ynnari so they gain the keyword while not losing the Dark Eldar keyword.

Bring the Yncarne so the birds can get the 6+ chance to ignore wounds/mortal wounds. Nice.

Bring some Chronos. Because they're still Dark Eldar the Chronos buffs still work on them, letting them regenerate wounds. I think it also lets them reroll 1s to wound or something else that's clutch.

Beastmasters for leadership and rerolling all to-hits!

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amishprn86
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PostSubject: Re: The Role of DE Beasts in 8th   Mon Jun 12 2017, 02:11

Wiat you can keep the PfP and still have Yncarne buff them? I miss read the way that works them, hot dog!.

And i have 3 Cronos!

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TeenageAngst
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PostSubject: Re: The Role of DE Beasts in 8th   Mon Jun 12 2017, 02:17

Birds don't get PfP so there is no loss in making them Ynnari. In fact you need to in order to access the Yncarne's buff, otherwise they have literally no saves of any kind.

And even if they're Ynnari you can bring haemonculus covens units in the same detachment, they just can't become Ynnari units and thus the Chronos themselves don't benefit from the Yncarne. But they get the same buff on turn 2 anyway from PfP so it doesn't matter.

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RedRegicide
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PostSubject: Re: The Role of DE Beasts in 8th   Mon Jun 12 2017, 02:19

Hahahahahaha i can't wait for the bat reps x)

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TeenageAngst
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PostSubject: Re: The Role of DE Beasts in 8th   Mon Jun 12 2017, 02:42

Just wait until the FW models get rules. Knowing how they like to write them, we're only seeing the tip of this iceberg.

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PostSubject: Re: The Role of DE Beasts in 8th   Mon Jun 12 2017, 02:58

I think the main problem will be that in order to attack in cc you need to be within an inch of the enemy unit or within an inch of a friendly model that is within an inch so trying to get all those bases within range will be pretty much impossible.
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PostSubject: Re: The Role of DE Beasts in 8th   Mon Jun 12 2017, 06:12

Who needs to get into base contact? Just swarm everything, an unending wave of birds that fills all empty space between models so that they can't fall back. Listen as the Cronos laugh, crushing the weakest link and healing the swarm, Beastmasters avoiding combat and keeping the flocks in line whilst that lonely Archon in a Venom rushes around trying to get objectives.

At this point, our opponent's inability to hit things more than 2" away is to his detriment, not our own.

Bonus points if you manage to intermingle combat, so that every flock is fighting at least three things and no one can work out where the line between Units ends.

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amishprn86
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PostSubject: Re: The Role of DE Beasts in 8th   Mon Jun 12 2017, 10:10

So... Yncarne give them a 6+++ and No Battleshock test?, you can have a Cronos to re give wounds back in melee and Beastmaster's for the Many flocks rerolls?

Am i doing this right?

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TeenageAngst
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PostSubject: Re: The Role of DE Beasts in 8th   Mon Jun 12 2017, 15:46

Yes. Those 3 units are your buffs. And that's just from casual observation I'm sure there's more I'm missing that could buff them more.

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