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 veteran switch to DE > BetrayTheWorld & skilled imput plz

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Slave
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PostSubject: veteran switch to DE > BetrayTheWorld & skilled imput plz   Fri May 12 2017, 22:20

hello. i have been playing competitive space wolves and necrons for many years (the game since 2nd).
i would like to switch to pure dark eldar for 8th edition for better or worse, as i enjoy the challenge of a finesse force (not to mention the excellent models).
i realize the new rules have not come out yet, but would still ask (especially BetraytheWorld and other veterans) for help with starting my model collection.
i am older and money is no object.
what pure dark eldar models and load outs are probable must includes for a solid list that will not autoflop if played correctly?
i ask now so that i may get a head start on the hobby process.
thank you very much for any help you may provide.
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TeenageAngst
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PostSubject: Re: veteran switch to DE > BetrayTheWorld & skilled imput plz   Fri May 12 2017, 22:36

Because we have no idea what the coming edition will yield I'm hesitant to suggest anything based on rules alone. Following my gut, Ravagers, Incubi, Voidraven Bombers, and Razorwing Jetfighters might be powerful. That's based on how flyers work in Age of Sigmar and what we know so far about units and vehicles. That is entirely speculation though.

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BetrayTheWorld
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PostSubject: Re: veteran switch to DE > BetrayTheWorld & skilled imput plz   Sat May 13 2017, 04:17

I'm flattered that you thought to specifically seek my advice, but like TA, I'm hesitant to give specific advice without knowing the rules of 8th edition. A large part of my "expertise" stems from the fact that I have a firm grasp of the basic rules and house rules applied by various tournament organizations. Because I have no idea what the new rules are going to be, at this point, I'm just like everyone else: Clueless.

That said, we can gather that they're trying to make ALL models relevant again from the tidbits they've released so far, so you can't really go wrong with purchasing some staple units, like wyches and kabalite warriors to start out with, since you'll almost certainly need them in order to meet the troop requirements.

So, were I you, I'd probably seek to pick up some troops and start putting them together and deciding on a paint theme, and wait for the rules to drop before I invested in any more expensive, specialized units like HQs, Vehicles, Fast Attack, or Elites.

I hope that helps, and welcome to the Dark City! Wink

P.S. I'd leave the weapons off of your troops until you know the rules. They're easier to paint without arms on anyhow.

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PostSubject: Re: veteran switch to DE > BetrayTheWorld & skilled imput plz   Sat May 13 2017, 04:30

Grabbing the get started box and assembling 80% should be fine.

Build 8 of the 10 warriors with rifles (since they will almost certainly have to take these) and leave the last 2 depending on the special weapons rules.

Build the 3 bikes but leave the weapons and optional upgrades off

Build the Raider but leave the weapon off

Don't do anything with the archon just yet - leave him for now.

This way you can get started without risking to much in the way of useless models

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PostSubject: Re: veteran switch to DE > BetrayTheWorld & skilled imput plz   Sat May 13 2017, 05:08

i really appreciate the replies, and hope that there will be more of them.
i'm looking forward to the release of the new rules, and hopefully more insight can be added to this thread (as i certainly will).
i think competitive players have egos (myself included), but one would be foolish not to be humble and learn from those with greater experience.

from doing general research thoughout all of 7th and the tail end of 6th, it seems that top end players generally included the following:
~6 venoms/30 warriors
~1 venom/archon/lhamaean
~18 bikes
~3 ravagers
corpsethiefclaw

less popular lists included:
~3 raiders/30 wyches (popular in the haywire grenade era)
~3 razorwings
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PostSubject: Re: veteran switch to DE > BetrayTheWorld & skilled imput plz   Sat May 13 2017, 05:36

Massaen's advice is likely to be pretty sound, but you never really know for sure.

Historically Dark Eldar have been a fast mechanised army that can dish out the damage, but can't take much in return. It hasn't felt much so much like that in 7th edition, as everyone else got faster, our shooting is less impressive, but we are more resilient. GW might try to return to the previous identity, or might leave us as a good combat force with some mobility.

My quick instinctive guesses:

Dark Eldar shooting which currently relies mostly on mass wounds will not be that impacted by save changes, others might be hurt more.

Our current vehicle issues might be helped by the rules changes. No particular evidence to back that up, more just a hope that rebalancing helps us with that issue.

Close combat units will rely on wiping their target out on the charge, as their target is likely to fall back if they aren't destroyed. That might make either devastating power hitters (e.g. Incubi), or resilient units (e.g. Grotesques and Sslyth) more valuable and attrition type units like Wyches who don't have toughness or armour less effective.

That said, I suspect they are aware Wyches aren't getting much game time, so will give them some kind of useful buff.

Explosive weapons look superbly good so far, so perhaps our flyers will be appealing too.

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PostSubject: Re: veteran switch to DE > BetrayTheWorld & skilled imput plz   Sat May 13 2017, 17:28

I would start with two start collecting boxes, 5 venoms, a razorwing, two or three ravagers, gangs of commorag, two squads of incubi, a squad of wyches and a succubi. Gives you a broad spectre of units. Follow up with two squads of scourges. Magnetize the living daylights out of them. The voidraven will probably be good in 8th, so get it in the long run. And grotesques.... All of them! Get all of the pretties!

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PostSubject: Re: veteran switch to DE > BetrayTheWorld & skilled imput plz   Sat May 13 2017, 19:53

Definitely magnetise weapons options where you can. It's hard to imagine that kabalite warriors, venoms, raiders & ravagers won't be useful.

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PostSubject: Re: veteran switch to DE > BetrayTheWorld & skilled imput plz   Mon May 15 2017, 14:24

Build what you will enjoy building, man. Every unit in the army will serve a purpose for you, just because something is commonly used in a netlist or in a tournament list from the last edition doesn't mean that a specific unit will not be viable for your play style.

Things that will always be useful:

Troops Choices
Raiders
Venoms
Talosi
Haemonculi
Scourges

Things that you may enjoy fielding (and likely will enjoy painting)
Mandrakes
Cronoses
Wracks

Honestly, as has been said before with the total overhaul coming in the new edition, making any real army predictions is much harder, but it is hard to believe that any models in any start collecting box will not be useful, after all, that is one of their new entry points for the game, and as such they won't make them bad, or box sales will decrease.
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PostSubject: Re: veteran switch to DE > BetrayTheWorld & skilled imput plz   Mon May 15 2017, 19:22

With changes to HQs and sniper weapons wracks could be more interesting in the new edition.
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PostSubject: Re: veteran switch to DE > BetrayTheWorld & skilled imput plz   Mon May 15 2017, 23:22

the new manly sized primaris space marines and vehicles just pushed me further into dark eldar.
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PostSubject: Re: veteran switch to DE > BetrayTheWorld & skilled imput plz   Tue May 16 2017, 02:51

My suggestion would be to buy model that you find attractive and try to make them work strategically as best you can when the rules comes out. But that is just me. I also second buying the basics like troops however I too would hold off on the HQ choice as characters are going to be very different in this edition and I suspect it would behoove us to see what our options are and how they compare to their equivalents before making an investment, even if money is not an issue.

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PostSubject: Re: veteran switch to DE > BetrayTheWorld & skilled imput plz   Thu May 18 2017, 16:14

One important advice - start small and build it gradually. Dont buy hell of a lot from the start. Believe me its far better to have a small painted collection, then a dozen of boxes lying around. Speaking from experience here.

Pretty big factor is motivation.

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