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 Anti-Psyker Pain Engine

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TheBaconPope
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PostSubject: Anti-Psyker Pain Engine   Fri Mar 10 2017, 02:51

As we all are aware, our Dark Kin are...less than adept at psychic defense. After a skirmish with Thousand Sons in which I managed to lose two squads of Reavers and a squad of Beastmasters (Read: My entire frontal assault force) in the first turn's Psychic Phase, I decided to cook up a unit that at least evens the playing field in a semi-fluffy way.

Full disclosure: This is a first draft that I'm looking for feedback on. The model in question should be a converted Talos or Cronos to give a feel of the general look of the thing.

Null Engine - 140 points
WS-3 | BS-3 | S-5 | T-7 | W-3 | I-4 | A-4 | Ld-10 | Sv-3+

Unit Type
Monstrous Creature

Unit Composition
1 Null Engine

Wargear
Armored Carapace
Blade of Perils
---
Blade of Perils | Range--- | S-User | AP--- | Melee, Perils
Perils - A Psyker who suffers an unsaved wound with the Perils Special Rule immediately rolls off with the attacking model, adding both their respective leadership values to the result. If the Psyker’s total is equal to or greater than the attacking model. nothing happens and the remainder of combat is resolved as normal. If the result is lower than the attacking model, the Psyker immediately suffers Perils of the Warp, with a -1 modifier to the result (to a minimum of 1).


Special Rules
Fearless
Feel No Pain
Night Vision
Null - A Psychic Power targeting a unit with at least one model with the Null Special Rule only passes their Psychic test on a roll of a 6+. A power targeting a unit within six inches of a model with the Null Special Rule passes their Psychic Test on a 5+. All models within 12” of a unit with the Null Special Rule have the Adamantium Will Special Rule. In addition, for the purposes of the opponent’s Psychic Phase and Deny the Witch tests, a model with the Null Special Rule counts as a Psyker with Mastery Level 2.

---

In a general sense, I think this offers a reasonable defense against Psykers. My main concerns, however, are,
1: Blade of Perils is a putrid weapon name, probably need something better
2: This thing might be over or under costed. There's no doubt its a big middle finger to your opponent's psychically inclined units, but aside from that, it's a Cronos without much else to offer.

Any help on this would be appreciated!
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Squidmaster
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PostSubject: Re: Anti-Psyker Pain Engine   Fri Mar 10 2017, 09:51

Seems reasonably well balanced actually. I would say the psychic defence would work best if based on the SPirit Probe, but that seems to be what you've gone for anyway.

My one comment might be that it has no ranged weapon, and could probably really do with one. Not necessarily a really powerful one, but SOMETHING.

On your concerns:

1. Yeah, Blades of Peril does sound a bit......meh. How about "Null BLades", or even "Perilous Blades".
2. I think the cost is about appropriate. It already ranks amongst our most expensive stuff, and more than a Talos which actually has a chance of KILLING something.

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Count Adhemar
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PostSubject: Re: Anti-Psyker Pain Engine   Fri Mar 10 2017, 09:57

Given that you can buy an entire Sisters of Silence squad with much better anti-psyker abilities for just over half the points of the Null Engine, I'd say you could up the power quite a bit without going OTT.

You could in fact just pretty much duplicate the rules of the Sisters (Psychic Abomination, Bane of Psykers and Psyk-out Grenades) and put them on the Cronos chassis and I reckon it would be a fantastic addition to our codex.

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TheBaconPope
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PostSubject: Re: Anti-Psyker Pain Engine   Fri Mar 10 2017, 12:44

Quote :
My one comment might be that it has no ranged weapon, and could probably really do with one. Not necessarily a really powerful one, but SOMETHING.

That's a good point, should I slap a splinter cannon or something similar in to round it out a bit?

Quote :
1. Yeah, Blades of Peril does sound a bit......meh. How about "Null BLades", or even "Perilous Blades".

For sure! I'll probably spend a few hours with a Thesaurus to come up with something grimdark.

Quote :
2. I think the cost is about appropriate. It already ranks amongst our most expensive stuff, and more than a Talos which actually has a chance of KILLING something.

Ah, yeah, that was a suggestion from one of my friends. I think a bit of a point reduction could be in order.

Quote :
Given that you can buy an entire Sisters of Silence squad with much better anti-psyker abilities for just over half the points of the Null Engine, I'd say you could up the power quite a bit without going OTT. You could in fact just pretty much duplicate the rules of the Sisters (Psychic Abomination, Bane of Psykers and Psyk-out Grenades) and put them on the Cronos chassis and I reckon it would be a fantastic addition to our codex.

That's a fair concern, regarding the cost. In the same sense, however, it would seem just a tad bit unbalanced if we could field multiple T7 3+ FNP units that essentially negate the opponents psychic phase. Sisters are the anti-psyker army, and I feel that copy pasting their rules onto a faction notorious for being susceptible to psykers would be more-than-a-little unfair.
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Count Adhemar
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PostSubject: Re: Anti-Psyker Pain Engine   Fri Mar 10 2017, 12:59

TheBaconPope wrote:
Quote :
Given that you can buy an entire Sisters of Silence squad with much better anti-psyker abilities for just over half the points of the Null Engine, I'd say you could up the power quite a bit without going OTT. You could in fact just pretty much duplicate the rules of the Sisters (Psychic Abomination, Bane of Psykers and Psyk-out Grenades) and put them on the Cronos chassis and I reckon it would be a fantastic addition to our codex.

That's a fair concern, regarding the cost. In the same sense, however, it would seem just a tad bit unbalanced if we could field multiple T7 3+ FNP units that essentially negate the opponents psychic phase. Sisters are the anti-psyker army, and I feel that copy pasting their rules onto a faction notorious for being susceptible to psykers would be more-than-a-little unfair.

I see your point although I don't really think DE are particularly susceptible to psykers, or no more so than humans or Orks. I actually think it's perfectly fluffy for Dark Eldar to have anti-psyker abilities, given that Vect has outlawed the use of psychic powers. How is that enforced? How does a DE army contend with psychic foes? How does/did Vect contain the daemons that have now flooded Commorragh since the breaking of Khaine's Gate? The background pretty much dictates that we should have access to this sort of ability in some way, shape or form. In fact I can see Vect organising entire realspace raids in the hope of enslaving a single Blank/Null/Sister/Culexus/whateverthehellelsetheImperiumgets for his own dark needs.

You should also consider that whilst T7 is good, a comparable points value of Sisters has more than 3 times as many wounds, the same armour save, access to transports etc. If you're worried about a sudden rash of Null Engines on the battlefield, limit them to 1 per Heavy Support (or Elite) slot, rather than the 1-3 for Talos and Cronos.

At the end of the day, this is your project and you can do what you want with it. I'm just passing on my thoughts on how I would handle it (and I'm now wishing I'd thought of it for my own codex).

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TheBaconPope
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PostSubject: Re: Anti-Psyker Pain Engine   Fri Mar 10 2017, 13:21

Quote :
How does a DE army contend with psychic foes? How does/did Vect contain the daemons that have now flooded Commorragh since the breaking of Khaine's Gate? The background pretty much dictates that we should have access to this sort of ability in some way, shape or form. In fact I can see Vect organising entire realspace raids in the hope of enslaving a single Blank/Null/Sister/Culexus/whateverthehellelsetheImperiumgets for his own dark needs.

Before the whole "Demons, Mandrakes, and Ynnead, oh my!" development, our Codex fluff mentions that Vect enslaved a few nulls to help contain Khaine's Gate, so it is pretty likely that there's a.few stitched together blanks floating around the Dark City.

In any case, I'll take a closer look at those rules and adjust as needed. Thanks for all the help!

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