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amorrowlyday
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PostSubject: Re: Uthwe Strike Force    Sun Feb 12 2017, 06:11

Since the Ulthwe bikes in the Ynnari Detachment also get deep strike we need to compare this rendering to the Ynnari version. the only forfeiture really is the loss of null deploy.
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TeenageAngst
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PostSubject: Re: Uthwe Strike Force    Sun Feb 12 2017, 06:16

It's just different shades of scatbikes, as you're essentially paying a tax no matter what you do now. If you rely on deep strikes you can use the expensive version, if you don't you get get the cheap one, and if you rely on obsec you can roll a CWE CAD. Personally, and I know this is blasphemy from a DE player, but I don't like deep striking when I don't have to. Flying on the board edge is pretty damn reliable and will usually allow you to accomplish the same task.

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Jimsolo
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PostSubject: Re: Uthwe Strike Force    Sun Feb 12 2017, 07:00

How are you Deep Striking your non-Ulthwe Scat Bikes?
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amorrowlyday
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PostSubject: Re: Uthwe Strike Force    Sun Feb 12 2017, 07:06

We aren't. We're just taking units in a reborn war host as an elite choice instead of as a part of a USF
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Jimsolo
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PostSubject: Re: Uthwe Strike Force    Sun Feb 12 2017, 07:07

Ah, gotcha.
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ShamPow1999
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PostSubject: Re: Uthwe Strike Force    Sun Feb 12 2017, 15:23

@Massaen Sorry about that!

@TeenageAngst Perhaps I should have included some more context. I really like the look of warwalkers, dire avengers, guardians and howling banshees so whenever I see a new way of including them in a force without the mandatory HQ choice I try to see if there's anyway it can work. Using ScatterBikes is probably more effective and yeah, in hindsight deepstriking guardian squads sounds a bit like bolter (or really anything fodder). I still thinks having several small ~60 point units appear 9" away from the enemy (or from a distance) could put out a fair
anount damage and serve as distraction in later turns for the rest of the army. It's basically like using warwalkers normally except they can flank on the first turn via deep strike (if that even marks any sense) rather than outflanking and coming on the second turn.

Thanks for replying! I guess the consensus is that the Ulthwe Strike Force is good for null deployment (maybe even better than the Scalpel Squadron?).
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CptMetal
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PostSubject: Re: Uthwe Strike Force    Sun Feb 12 2017, 17:15

Problem with the scalpel squadron is that I don't need the Wracks inside. Only the venoms.

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Mononcule
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PostSubject: Re: Uthwe Strike Force    Sun Feb 12 2017, 18:37

CptMetal wrote:
Problem with the scalpel squadron is that I don't need the Wracks inside. Only the venoms.

Id like to try them with the Yncarne. When the venom get destroyed you can spawn the Yncarne, and you have 5 expendable ealdari bodies that each heals the Yncarne on 3+ when they die. If someone shoot the second venom you get a free 6" move with the Yncarne.

If you combine scalpel with the new T1 webway assault you have greater chance to trigger first blood.


EDIT: hmm if I understand correctly you can have 4x3 scatterbikes that deploy in deepstrike without scatter T1 for roughly the same price. 48 S6 AP6 shots sound scarier than 24 poison + 2 ossefactor shots.
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BetrayTheWorld
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PostSubject: Re: Uthwe Strike Force    Sun Feb 12 2017, 19:22

Mononcule wrote:

Id like to try them with the Yncarne. When the venom get destroyed you can spawn the Yncarne, and you have 5 expendable ealdari bodies that each heals the Yncarne on 3+ when they die. If someone shoot the second venom you get a free 6" move with the Yncarne.

If you combine scalpel with the new T1 webway assault you have greater chance to trigger first blood.

Good thinking. I like it! Wink

The Yncarne really does mesh well with null deployment strategies.

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Mononcule
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PostSubject: Re: Uthwe Strike Force    Mon Feb 13 2017, 00:56

Cant wait to try it Smile

However the Yncarne gives fearless and FNP to nearby Ynnari units, and those are powerful buffs. Coven wracks are not ynnari and anyway already have fnp and will gain fearless quickly. It would probably be better to use other deepstrikers to benefit from Ynead stirs...

Unfortunately USF are not Ynnari, but these black eldars can be taken as elite in a warhost and then become Ynnari, but will come from deepstrike only from turn 2.

But as I see it they can be a nice reinforcement of bodies to drop around the Yncarne.
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Count Adhemar
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PostSubject: Re: Uthwe Strike Force    Mon Feb 13 2017, 07:25

Mononcule wrote:
EDIT: hmm if I understand correctly you can have 4x3 scatterbikes that deploy in deepstrike without scatter T1 for roughly the same price. 48 S6 AP6 shots sound scarier than 24 poison + 2 ossefactor shots.

Remember though, you only get to roll for reserves on turn 1. It's not automatic, you still have to make the roll, so you can't guarantee arriving and that messes up a null deploy tactic.

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colinsherlow
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PostSubject: Re: Uthwe Strike Force    Mon Feb 13 2017, 07:35

The USF detachment is really good. Being able to fully null deploy is really good. And doing it accurately is really good. Just make sure to bring an Autarch. You don't want to roll a bunch of 1s and 2s and not have any units show up.

I already own a bunch of Ulthwe Storm and Defender Guardians so I am really excited to try this out.
Being able to drop some melta, mass Shuriken and war walkers will be really nice.

I think this could be fun with the new Avatar guy as well. If you do kill anything or any of your units die just have him show up. Probably best to have him show in your opponents turn so that he can assault on your turn.

Also this and the Scalpel Squadron could be cool

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Mononcule
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PostSubject: Re: Uthwe Strike Force    Mon Feb 13 2017, 12:01

Count Adhemar wrote:
Mononcule wrote:
EDIT: hmm if I understand correctly you can have 4x3 scatterbikes that deploy in deepstrike without scatter T1 for roughly the same price. 48 S6 AP6 shots sound scarier than 24 poison + 2 ossefactor shots.

Remember though, you only get to roll for reserves on turn 1. It's not automatic, you still have to make the roll, so you can't guarantee arriving and that messes up a null deploy tactic.

Good point, scalpel could be better in that case. And I was wrong with the point costs: scalpel is quite cheaper than 12 black squatbikes.
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Count Adhemar
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PostSubject: Re: Uthwe Strike Force    Mon Feb 13 2017, 12:27

Mononcule wrote:
Count Adhemar wrote:
Mononcule wrote:
EDIT: hmm if I understand correctly you can have 4x3 scatterbikes that deploy in deepstrike without scatter T1 for roughly the same price. 48 S6 AP6 shots sound scarier than 24 poison + 2 ossefactor shots.

Remember though, you only get to roll for reserves on turn 1. It's not automatic, you still have to make the roll, so you can't guarantee arriving and that messes up a null deploy tactic.

Good point, scalpel could be better in that case. And I was wrong with the point costs: scalpel is quite cheaper than 12 black squatbikes.

Take an Autarch and you have 4 x 2+ rolls to fail before your null deploy costs you the game.

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Jimsolo
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PostSubject: Re: Uthwe Strike Force    Mon Feb 13 2017, 14:05

It's a possibility, but I'll play those odds.
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Count Adhemar
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PostSubject: Re: Uthwe Strike Force    Mon Feb 13 2017, 14:11

Jimsolo wrote:
It's a possibility, but I'll play those odds.

With my dice rolling I'd have to think twice Sad

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