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 A Brave New Lore

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Vindicavi
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PostSubject: A Brave New Lore   Thu Feb 09 2017, 18:13

Just returned to 40k after a long absence and I've been catching up on the new lore.






In all seriousness what do people think of the interesting direction GW is taking?
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Jimsolo
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PostSubject: Re: A Brave New Lore   Fri Feb 10 2017, 06:55

I could not be loving it more. It's wonderful.
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Vindicavi
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PostSubject: Re: A Brave New Lore   Fri Feb 10 2017, 12:16

Why am I imagining you had a gun to your head while writing that?
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Ynneadwraith
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PostSubject: Re: A Brave New Lore   Fri Feb 10 2017, 13:09

Haha! Very nice Wink

I started out by baulking to it. Didn't like the idea of change one bit, as it could really mess up people's armies that they've invested time and money into.

However, after a little while I started to see the potential that these changes are bringing for making new narratives. For instance, I quite like the idea that after the destruction of Biel Tan the eldar there form some sort of warlike Migrant Fleet and strike out through the void in search of an abandoned craftworld to reforge their nation.

I quite like the idea of the existing eldar factions having to cope with the shakeup that the Ynnari have caused, and the power struggles that will result from it.

For instance, my Craftworld uses vat-born conscripts from Commorragh to bolster their numbers after an Iyanden-style extinction event. They can stomach the desertion of many of their population, but have to send a warhost to help get Commorragh back in order first. Although they were Ynnead worshippers before the apotheosis, they're shocked and appalled by the events that are unfolding, and are very wary and skeptical of the new Ynnari Death Cults springing up.

I've been comforted by the fact that no factions have been completely destroyed (a real fear given what happened to Tomb Kings and Brettonians). Instead, they've expanded the universe with a new faction, which has opened up all kinds of possibilities for interactions of a different sort between different Eldar populations Smile

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Vindicavi
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PostSubject: Re: A Brave New Lore   Fri Feb 10 2017, 13:45

My problems with the new lore stems from how badly it seems to have been written. The Marvel-ising of 40k is becoming a big worry it seems to no longer be about the events, the wars and the setting as much as certain key characters. The main characters have become too central to the plot for example the Saint Celestine Abaddon and Creed situation, there was no need or much logic behind that encounter and nothing was achieved during it, all involved surivived somehow. I think they've also missed an opportunity to satisfyingly conclude some old characters story- arcs by giving them an ending, the perfect example being Creed as discussed on splintermind. He should have died with Cadia, that was always his thing and the loss of him and Cadia would have been more impactful on players who liked his character in terms of showing how much of a deal Chaos is.

I have no words for The Black Templars going off with the Eldar.

The return of a primarch and possibly more makes me very concerned about this being End Times for 40k, especially with hints that the SW will find Russ, it feels like the gathering for the final battle which I desperately hope it isnt.

From what I've heard about the new Eldar lore; Ynnead plotline damn cool, Khaines gate opening awesome. The new faction is interesting though the rules sound stupidly overpowered, an additional action after killing a unit... I cant see how that could possibly be abused. Though what concerns me is the way things seem to be heading towards an age of Sigma super alliance situation with the DE, Eldar and Imperium teaming up.

I hope gamesworkshop can pull it together and take their time to think things through before they publish more books with factions acting out of character and hurling the plot forward into a bigger mess of lore. This new writing is making the world of 40k feel so much smaller with every key event happening with famous well known characters being involved when there is no reason they should be. When it comes to characters in 40k its important to remember "the Universe is a big place and whatever happens, you will not be missed..."

TL;DR 40k should be about events not main characters, resolving mysteries of lore always leads to disappointment.
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Ynneadwraith
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PostSubject: Re: A Brave New Lore   Fri Feb 10 2017, 15:01

Yeah I agree with you on every single one of those points.

The growing tendency for 40k stories to revolve around characters rather than conflicts makes the universe feel smaller, which is a problem.

The questionable alliance between Eldar and IoM pointing towards a Grand Alliance style thing is another issue, although I don't actually think that that's what's going to happen. The relationship between humans and eldar is a lot more caustic than that between men and elves. I do actually have faith that the writers know that, based on the depiction of their negotiation of the truce.

The notion of Templars and Eldar working together is, frankly, ludicrous. However, I'll reserve judgement until the end of the story arc. If they both betray each other spectacularly then I'll be happy. If not, I'll be worried. Even if they do, it's the chuffing Templars. They killed all the human slaves captured by The Beast's orks because they might have been tainted by the xenos. They'd rather die gloriously where they stood than consort with xenos.

I absolutely agree with you that while the story's neat, I don't like the direction. That's why, as far as I'm concerned, I'll be creating my own lore and stories entwining the new events that better fit my interpretation of what 40k should be. Almost unique among IPs, 40k is very, very encouraging of that.

If Marvel characters sell enough models to keep GW in business and producing the models that myself (and others) use to make a better version of 40k then so be it.

Til then, if you need some refreshing grimdarkness, check out some of these for the potential of what 40k can be with a bit of imagination:

https://ironsleet.com/
http://convertorum.blogspot.co.uk/
https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/0/584689.page
http://www.bolterandchainsword.com/topic/322490-beneath-terra-inquisimunda-the-xith-legion/

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Ynneadwraith
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PostSubject: Re: A Brave New Lore   Fri Feb 10 2017, 15:34

Oh, I'd like to get your ideas about this actually. Seems you think along the same lines as myself: http://www.thedarkcity.net/t14977-what-do-people-think-about-this-idea-of-how-gw-should-be-run

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Vindicavi
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PostSubject: Re: A Brave New Lore   Fri Feb 10 2017, 17:37

I'm very much of the opinion that each character in the setting should have a point where they will die set in stone to avoid this kind of marvel-ising of them, these points dont ever need to be reached but I think its important for new characters to come to prominence and also to die or fade into obscurity.

For example, for me Vect will die during or before the fall of Commoragh it was him who made the dark city what it is today and that has to be the end point of his character, the same with Creed and Cadia. If characters can never die no matter what happens then they aren't an interesting character and will always find some way to survive with a "haha this was really my plan all along"
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Squidmaster
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PostSubject: Re: A Brave New Lore   Sat Feb 11 2017, 11:07

♫ A whole new lore...... ♫
♫ A whole new way to assault in the wallet. ♫

I apologise. It was the first thign that popped into my head when I saw the thread.

Otherwise, I'm enjoying where this is going. I quite like it so far, even though I have a feeling of dread in the back of my mind. I hope to be wrong.
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