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 Returning player, need some advice

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Shadowharte
Hellion
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Join date : 2013-05-14

PostSubject: Returning player, need some advice   Tue Dec 27 2016, 23:50

Hello fellow Archons,

I have started looking for groups near where I live, but have yet to play 7th edition. I wanted to get some advice regarding my list. I would like to keep shredders because I want to at least give them a chance, but this list is primarily ment to be a Kabal forces only type of list. I want it to be fast. Without further stalling here it is.

+++ Kabal of the Skittering Madness (1459pts) +++

++ DE Realspace Raiders Detachment ++

+ HQ +

····Archon [Blaster, Clone field, Webway portal]

+ Elites +

5xTrueborn (4 Blasters)
······Raider [Night Shields]

4xMandrakes

+ Troops +

5xKabalites (1 Shredder)
······Venom [Splinter Cannon]

10xKabalites (1 Shredder)
······Raider [Night Shields, Splinter Racks]

10xKabalites (1 Shredder)
······Raider [Night Shields, Splinter Racks]

5xKabalites (1 Shredder)
······Venom [Splinter Cannon]

5xKabalites (1 Shredder)
······Venom [Splinter Cannon]

+ Fast Attack +

3xReavers (1 Cluster Caltrops, 1 Blaster)

3xReavers (1 Cluster Caltrops, 1 Blaster)

5xScourge (4 Blasters)

+ Heavy Support +

····Ravager [Dark Lance, Dark Lance, Dark Lance, Night Shields]

Edit: I did somewhat try to follow the 'Rule of 9' from the Splintermind podcast.
Edit 2: Apologize for originally just copy pasting from battlescribe. Cleaned up the list.
I guess mentioning the only models I have access too are 40 Warriors, 40 Wyches, 1 Archon, 1 Succubus, Razorwing, 4 or 5 Raiders, 3 Venoms, 5 Mandrakes, 5 Incubi, 6 Reavers, 5 Scourge, 2 Ravagers. I wanted to have only Kabal units, but due to the lack of models I had to include Reavers as well. I figured the Shredders would be nice to try, I read a thread where they talked about the shredders and it made me want to test them for myself.
I figured the tank hunters would be Trueborn, Scourge, Ravager, and Reavers could if needed. Everything else would be focused on anti infantry.
I am not overly competitive, but do still enjoy winning, not sure what local metas are since I have not taken the hour drives to any of the stores near me.
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Rewind
Kabalite Warrior
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Posts : 205
Join date : 2016-05-12
Location : Surrey

PostSubject: Re: Returning player, need some advice   Wed Dec 28 2016, 22:37

Hi there,

As a returning player, I think you'll have a blast with the list as you have it, down your LFGS your hardly likely so face super cheese, so you'll do fine.

Feel free to keep your Shredders in the Raiders, but drop from the Venoms, you'll want to be moving more than 6" every turn with Venoms, meaning you'll fire both Splinter Cannons @ full BS, but be snap firing the Shredder.

Why the RSR if your only using 3 FA slots? Go CAD and you'd have 10 ob. sec. units! (Troops + Transports)

Oh and HWB or Lance on Scourges, they are dedicated AT & pretty much the best we have.

If I was list building with your collection, for a fun friendly game, i'd probably:

DE CAD 1499

Succubus, AOM, Glaive, HWG
4 x Incubi incl. Klaivex, Raider
4 x Mandrakes
3 x 5 Warriors incl. Syb, HWG, Cannon Venoms
3 x 5 Warriors incl. Syb, HWG, Raiders
2 x 3 Reavers, CC
5 x Scourges, 4 HWB
2 x Triple Lance Ravagers

The great news is you have a fine collection of miniatures to make alot of fun variations Smile

Good luck however you run, but please let us now how you get on Smile
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Chippen
Hellion
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Posts : 54
Join date : 2016-12-18

PostSubject: Re: Returning player, need some advice   Thu Dec 29 2016, 20:19

If you've listened to Splintermind, you probably know that a good DE list is built around MSU, and each unit having a specific purpose, with redundant units achieving the same purpose. With that in mind, you need to ask yourself - what purpose does this unit have, and what other units accomplish the same purpose? If you can answer that and feel you have enough of an answer for each type of unit you'll face (blob/swarm, MEQ, TEQ, MC, Tank) then you're golden!

Specific advice - I'm not personally a fan of Shredders. They're fine for anti-horde en masse from a single unit, but at 12 inches, you've got to play a dangerous game to see any use. There are better ways to get your anti-infantry rocks off if you ask me, especially from a Raider - with Splinter Racks, a Splinter Cannon instead of a Shredder becomes way better.

For the Scourge, I much prefer the cheaper Heat Lances unless I'm going full anti-vehicle hard-on, in which case they get Haywire Blasters. And if you're only going to run one tri-Lance Ravager, making them vehicle hunters isn't a bad idea.

-edit-

Oh, and what's the rule of 9? Which episode of the podcast covered it?

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hekatrixxy
Kabalite Warrior
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Join date : 2016-06-18

PostSubject: Re: Returning player, need some advice   Thu Dec 29 2016, 22:42

@Chippen I think he meant the law of 9s which is what Skari mentioned he uses as a template for list building. Divide your available points into 9 portions, 1 for HQ, 4 for troops, 1 for Elites, 1 for Fast Attack, 1 for Heavy Support and the last 1 for wherever you want it.

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Project log: Kabal of the Warded Blade
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amorrowlyday
Hekatrix
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Join date : 2015-03-15
Location : Massachusetts

PostSubject: Re: Returning player, need some advice   Thu Dec 29 2016, 22:44

Heatlances and haywire blasters cost the same on Scourges.

Shredders are fine, especially in kabalite squads. If they aren't within 12" they are wasting half their shooting potential anyway. I also agree that they should be cut from the venoms, more that they should never be within 24" of a threat in the first place than that they'll be consistently firing snapshots tho. I also have found that think of them as anti-horde weapons just because they are blast weapons is a mistake. Even if you shoot at a single 25mm based model like an inquisitor or something you're only slightly less likely to hit them on scatter than direct fire. With even one tight ring of bodyguards you're more likely to hit. The magic is in the S6+shred because of that shredders are more likely to inflict 1 wound than a rapid fire range'd splinter rifle is against any target other than a T7+ non-GMC.
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Shadowharte
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PostSubject: Re: Returning player, need some advice   Thu Dec 29 2016, 23:44

Unfortunately I do not have the Venoms necessary to take advantage of a MSU type list. I have a total of 3 Venoms.

@Rewind Thanks for pointing out the relevance of the CAD instead of the RSR. Since I haven't played this edition it never even crossed my mind. I just saw we had a formation so I latched onto it. Later on I may increase my amount of FA slots used, but for now I will swap to a CAD

@Chippen Yes I was referring to the law of 9s Skari mentioned in episode 24. I do think I will be replacing the HWB onto my scourge. I haven't listened to all of the Podcast just the first 3 episodes I think then half of episode 24. I knew about the MSU thing last edition when I had already bought my models and started looking at this forum, but at that point I figured I could try and work with what I have.

I will definitely take the Shredders off the Venoms

@amorrowlyday That is similar to what I was thinking about the shredders having just the same or even better chances to hurt something, also since our splinter weapons ap is negligible against MEQ I figured the lack of ap didn't really mean squat.

Also, thank you everyone for your replies and advice.
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