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CptMetal
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PostSubject: Re: gangs of Commorragh!?   Fri Dec 23 2016, 23:06

I think you missed the Kabalite Warrior. They are pretty awesome actually. Cheap, poison weapon and will get more resilient by the turn

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PostSubject: Re: gangs of Commorragh!?   Fri Dec 23 2016, 23:41

Back on topic, as I understand it, there's going to be something or other about Gangs of Commorragh in the January White Dwarf. Does anyone know when the January White Dwarf is supposed be released?

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PostSubject: Re: gangs of Commorragh!?   Sat Dec 24 2016, 05:24

@Count Adhemar wrote:
@stevethedestroyeofworlds wrote:
@BetrayTheWorld wrote:

Tyranid - Swarmlord, Hive Tyrant, Carnifex
Are you sure?
The Swarmlord and Flyrants sure, but the Carnifex?
Doesn't it lack decent shooting, and lack the ability to stand toe to toe with a Talos?

It can certainly be equipped for shooting as it can take two twin-linked devourers with brainleech worms, ie the same armament as a Flyrant. And 3 S9, AP2 attacks in melee plus D3 S9 HoW hits is not to be sneezed at.

This, and let's not split hairs here. The point is Talos value isn't far better than par for the course.

¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥

@CptMetal wrote:
I think you missed the Kabalite Warrior. They are pretty awesome actually. Cheap, poison weapon and will get more resilient by the turn

I mean, again, not objectively. They're not BAD. They're just not good. Look at their peers(other troops):

Skitaari Vanguard - Same Price - Same S and T, Better armour save, same BS, FnP 6+, Assault 3 18" rending guns that doubletap on rends.

Imperial Guard Veterans - 3 points cheaper - Almost identical statlines, with frag grenades but lasguns instead of poison. Far more options for the squads, making them more flexible.

Tactical Marines - For 5 points per model more and a weapon swap to a bolter, they get: +1S, +1T, Frag Grenades, Krak Grenades, 3+ armor saves, and chapter tactics.

Eldar Windriders
- For 8 points per unit, they give up power from pain and poison weapons for a jetbike and rending weapons. That basically gives them a 3+ armor save, up to 48" movement, and T4 for 8 points per man.

Eldar Guardians - Same price. Identical statline. Basically gives up power from pain and a bit of weapon range for Rending guns, plasma grenades, and battle focus. Lateral move, in my opinion.

¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥¥

Basically all of these are a similar power level or stronger when adjusted for price:  Tau Fire Warriors, Necron Warriors, Ork Boys, Blood claws, grey hunters, Bloodletters, Pink Horrors, Plaguebearers, Daemonettes, Termagaunts, Hormagaunts, and so on, and so forth...

Kabalite warriors aren't "good"(ie superior/above average) . They're simply decent/ok/adequate.

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Ynneadwraith
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PostSubject: Re: gangs of Commorragh!?   Sat Dec 24 2016, 10:32

Oh, I'd take Pink Horrors off the list of similarly powered units now that Split and Split Again are things...

Pink Horrors are nasty...

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PostSubject: Re: gangs of Commorragh!?   Sat Dec 24 2016, 12:05

@Calyptra wrote:
Back on topic, as I understand it, there's going to be something or other about Gangs of Commorragh in the January White Dwarf. Does anyone know when the January White Dwarf is supposed be released?
I want to say I seen a post on dakka about it being week 3 or 4 WD release.
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PostSubject: Re: gangs of Commorragh!?   Sat Dec 24 2016, 12:44

I have to agree with BTW here.
The only above average units we have are venoms, reavers and grots.
The rest are just OK.

On topic I really hope this is a supp that makes hellions great and reavers even better.
This does smell like a stand alone game tho (that no one will ever play). Hopefully it has a bunch of reavers in it at a cheap price.
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PostSubject: Re: gangs of Commorragh!?   Sat Dec 24 2016, 15:43

@Painjunky wrote:

This does smell like a stand alone game tho (that no one will ever play).

I WILL PLAY IT.

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PostSubject: Re: gangs of Commorragh!?   Sat Dec 24 2016, 17:16

@BetrayTheWorld wrote:

¤¥¤¥¤¤¥¤¥¤¤¥¤¥¤¤¥¤¥¤¤¥¤¥¤¤¥¤¥¤¤¥¤¥¤¤¥¤¥¤¤¥¤¥¤¤¥¤¥¤¤¥¤¥¤¤¥¤¥¤¤¥¤¥¤¤¥¤¥¤

Everything else on the list, something from another faction can do their job better, cheaper, or both.

Even Talos aren't that great compared to other MCs available to other factions. They're merely "OK".

All these MCs from other factions could kill equal or greater points worth of Talos:

Necron - C'tan Shard of the Nightbringer, Transcendent C'tan
Chaos Daemons - Pretty much every named daemon or daemon prince equipped for combat
Eldar - Wraithknights & Wraithlords
Tau - Ghostkeels, Riptides & Storm surges
Tyranid - Swarmlord, Hive Tyrant, Carnifex

That is the company Talos keeps. Those are the Talos' peers. That is what you're comparing to when you decide whether or not Talos are "Good".

And that's without even considering all of the non monstrous creatures various factions have that can deal with Talos handily, such as a basic space marine with a grav cannon, or walkers.

Assuming the Talos has Ichor Injectors:

The C'tan is nearly double the points, has shorter range and whilst more powerful shooting it's completely random, close combat is nearly even though since the C'tan is hitting on 3's (Nightbringer) or 4's (Transcendant) and wounding on 3's whilst the Talos is hitting on 4's and wounding on 2's and both have the same number of attacks. In this case the Talos is clearly far more points efficient.

Yes, a kitted out Daemon Prince would ruin a Talos in combat quite easily, but how many points did you spend on it, nearly 400?

Wraithknights are GMC's so not a stright comparison and we all know it's badly undercosted for what it can do, though interestingly a Talos should be able to hold out longer against the Skathach with Deathshroud Cannons longer than either the Wraithcannon or Sword and Board varieties. Wraithlords are an easy win for the Talos which has both better shooting (6 twin linked poison shots a turn will wittle away at a Wraithlord) and considerably better close combat (hitting on 3's, wounding on 2's, ID on 6's and minimum 4 attacks against hitting on 4's, wounding on 2's without ID and only 3 attacks). The Talos is more survivable with FnP as well.

A Talos can soak up a huge amount of firepower, especially if you have a Cronos nearby and whilst it's shooting isn't likely to do a huge amount of damage to a Ghostkeel or Riptide once they've been caught in combat will die very quickly, all for considerably more points than a Talos. The Stormsurge is a different kettle of fish being a GMC, but a squad of 3 Talos are likely to be cheaper and survive long enough to get into combat with it where they will win thanks to 15 attacks on the charge netting you a pretty good chance of landing a few 6's for ID.

The Swarmlord and Hive Tyrant probably will win in combat thanks to ID on the Boneswords/Sabers, higher WS and I, but the Tyrant's shooting would actually be less effective thanks to wounding on 5's and having to get through a 3+ and FnP as opposed to wounding on 4's and only having the single 3+ to get through (rate of fire might even it out to being a waste of time for both sides). Carnifexes will die with ease due to the Talos hitting faster and better whilst the Fex's shooting is even less effective than the Tyrants due to BS3.

This is not to say the Talos is a top tier unit, it's horribly fragile to Strength D, ID and massed grav or the like (what isnt?) but it's very tough, rather cheap and holds up quite nicely against plenty of other MC's. Of course the biggest problem with these comparisons is they're all being done in a vacuum, no army works like that.

As for the Whight Dwarf, I believe it's out on the 6th so we should be getting some sort of leaks regarding Gangs of Commoragh in the next couple of weeks.



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PostSubject: Re: gangs of Commorragh!?   Sat Dec 24 2016, 20:57

@Imateria wrote:

As for the Whight Dwarf, I believe it's out on the 6th so we should be getting some sort of leaks regarding Gangs of Commoragh in the next couple of weeks.

I hope you're right because I MUST KNOW.

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PostSubject: Re: gangs of Commorragh!?   Sun Dec 25 2016, 03:48

@Imateria wrote:

The C'tan is nearly double the points,

Let me go ahead and stop you there. I said that everything on that list was "equal points of X would be better than or equal to Y", meaning that equal points of Talos -could- get killed by equal points of C'tan, equal points of Wraithknights, etc. It's adjusted for points cost.

A wraithknight can easily kill 2-3 Talos with ichor injectors. It wouldn't even be a huge surprise for a wraithknight to kill an entire corpsethief claw with ichor injectors. We've run the simulations on this several times in the past, and it happens enough in this case to not view a corpsethief claw as a cost effective way of dealing with a wraithknight.

A shard of the nightbringer can kill two Talos as well. It might not do it every time, but it is entirely capable of doing so. Aside from powers of the c'tan random shooting, it also has a built-in psychic shriek that doesn't have to roll a psychic roll(death gaze), that does 3d6 minus leadership in wounds that are AP 2 and ignore cover(perfect for killing Talos).

The entire point is, if you start looking closely into what those various units are capable of, you'll find that Talos are perfectly adequate for their price point, but they're certainly not a value buy in the current meta.

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PostSubject: Re: gangs of Commorragh!?   Sun Dec 25 2016, 10:57

And what do you exactly plan on doing about that? Now that you have identified the problem, a solution would be great.

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PostSubject: Re: gangs of Commorragh!?   Sun Dec 25 2016, 17:11

WHY CAN'T WE ALL BE FRIENDS

lol

it is christmas after all
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PostSubject: Re: gangs of Commorragh!?   Sun Dec 25 2016, 17:18

@CptMetal wrote:
And what do you exactly plan on doing about that? Now that you have identified the problem, a solution would be great.

Solution? Make sure people know the problem.

Some things aren't meant to be solved by us.

If I say "Company X is a bad company that doesn't care about it's employees.", you can't respond with, "Well how are you going to fix that?"

I have nothing to do with the company. I hope that DE get fixed when we get an update, but I can't personally fix it. I can only ensure that people KNOW about it, and hopefully then lend their voice to the choir to pressure the company to change it.

When a DE player says X unit is good, it's from the perspective of a person who plays a faction that is NOT currently good, so it's often not an objective opinion. It's like a battered wife with stockholme syndrome, who defends their abuser despite objective evidence that they're not good. They're so emotionally and financially invested in the army, and so accustomed to abuse in the form of garbage rules that they amplify and highlight the few aspects of the faction that aren't negatives to be far more positive than they actually are.

The first step to recovery is admitting you have a problem. I'm just trying to get as many people to step 1 as possible. Wink

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PostSubject: Re: gangs of Commorragh!?   Sun Dec 25 2016, 18:06

Yeah, but the problem is well known already and quite subjective.
You, for example, think that dark Eldar Warriors are garbage. I think they are great since they are very very good against stuff like bikes, wraith constructs, monstrous creatures and everything with a big toughness value. Against Death Guard, I prefer Kabalite Warriors over Space Marines or imperial guard.
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PostSubject: Re: gangs of Commorragh!?   Sun Dec 25 2016, 18:45

In the current meta, warriors are pretty decent.
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PostSubject: Re: gangs of Commorragh!?   Sun Dec 25 2016, 19:04

@CptMetal wrote:
Yeah, but the problem is well known already and quite subjective.
You, for example, think that dark Eldar Warriors are garbage.

I didn't say dark eldar warriors are garbage. They're perfectly OK. But you don't seem to recognize what I'm saying when I say objectively good, or perhaps you simply didn't read my long posts, which I couldn't blame you for, but which I'd expect you to then not respond to.

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PostSubject: Re: gangs of Commorragh!?   Sun Dec 25 2016, 19:16

I liked it better when we were talking about Gangs of Commorragh.
I hope it's an actual board game, with a pretty board and everything. Then, no matter what 40k is like, we can still play a game that's all about how awesome Dark Eldar are.

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PostSubject: Re: gangs of Commorragh!?   Sun Dec 25 2016, 21:17

I don't like boardgames since I have no one to play them with. I just collect the minis these days. The gaming community around here is falling apart due to the weirdos starting to appear and ruin it.
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PostSubject: Re: gangs of Commorragh!?   Mon Dec 26 2016, 00:02

@Xivai wrote:
I don't like boardgames since I have no one to play them with. I just collect the minis these days. The gaming community around here is falling apart due to the weirdos starting to appear and ruin it.

Am I the only one who wants to hear more about the weirdo's? lol
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PostSubject: Re: gangs of Commorragh!?   Mon Dec 26 2016, 00:16

Tell us about the wierdos, Slave. Twisted Evil

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PostSubject: Re: gangs of Commorragh!?   Mon Dec 26 2016, 01:46

@BetrayTheWorld wrote:
@CptMetal wrote:
Yeah, but the problem is well known already and quite subjective.
You, for example, think that dark Eldar Warriors are garbage.  

I didn't say dark eldar warriors are garbage. They're perfectly OK. But you don't seem to recognize what I'm saying when I say objectively good, or perhaps you simply didn't read my long posts, which I couldn't blame you for, but which I'd expect you to then not respond to.

Not very pleasant.

Let's stop the doom and gloom, please.

Lev

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PostSubject: Re: gangs of Commorragh!?   Mon Dec 26 2016, 01:58

This is long ans copy and pasted from my post on dakka.

I think I'm ready to share my one and only "friendly" local game store story. I was invited out to play Armada by a guy who moved to town recently to marry his girlfriend he met on the internet. He adds me on facebook and I only take a quick glance at his facebook page. No images of him stand out just internet memes and stuff I only glance and say I'll get a good look at him in the store.

He claims to be a newbie during all of this who has only recently started the game. After we establish contact through the flgs community facebook page we start setting armada battle terms.

It's been months since I've played the game so I tell him I'm a little rusty. I say I want a 300 point game (forgetting 400 is standard). He messages me saying he went over with 9 points over and asks me if its okay. I say sure its a friendly game only if I can go over too. He got mad at first but I think he misunderstood me and I say only up to the 9 over he is at and calms down.

The next day he messages me and asks if its okay if we don't play with objectives since he is a newbie and it confuses him. I say sure but something is going off in my brain about how specific of a request this is. I know as a rebel player I often need to play to objectives depending on my list, but maybe he is geunely trying to learn. At the same time how can you learn if your not abiding the rules? I allow him this but have a bad feeling. I bring a back up list that's got some more potency than my nwbie friendly list.

My list was a Rebel Assault Frigate, Nebulon B, and the Mon Calamary Torpedo Frigate. A very light casual list. I also take some A-Wings and some upgrades here and there like the paragon and the enhanced armaments to try and use my side dice. It's decent but fluffy. Just in case I bring a Mon Calamari Cruiser which is the rebels Star Destroyer equivalent since my bad vibes were on full. I was not going to cheese it out. Also I only had Wave 2 ships and am vastly behind in upgrades and only collect rebel ships so some stuff was not available to me. Not that it mattered since I wasn't net listing. The Mon Cal Cruiser was my insurance since he said we might have time for two games and if I needed to up my list a little. I didn't bring the full breadth of cheesy upgrades for it though and was just going to use what I had in my casual list on it.

Two days before the battle I remember I want 400 points and ask if its cool. He says no and gets mad and taunts me a little over this. He also says one other person is coming and I have to fight with him in a 2 on 1 again a bad sign of him power gaming since two strangers who just meet for the first time ever are not going to coordinate well. On top of this he asks for no turn limit since he wants a pure blast them game.

The day before the game he shows me a picture of his case and he has almost two of every ship in the game Imperial and Rebel and all the new ships as well. And front and center is a great big Star Destroyer. I say to myself he won't use it. What kind of newbie is this? I don't upgrade my army and give him the benefit of the doubt despite getting weird vibes.

We meet and immediately something is really off about this guy. Most nerds I know are pretty reserved folks they don't talk much to outsiders and its really hard to get in with them and their cliques. Can't say I'm an exception or the old guy who turned up was an exception. The old dude clearly was a newbie and barely knew how to use a maneuvering tool. The other guy says he watches tournament videos. In my head I say this is weird since he claims to be a newbie now he claims to have watched the national finals and yes he brings a net list just for such an occasion.

My fears are founded when he plops down that ISD, an Imperial Raider with Moff Tarken in it and is clearly net listing the gak out of his army. My list was a casual list that HAD to play to objectives perfectly to stand a chance against the firepower of an ISD or needed perfect micro.

We are setting up the table and talking. He loves to talk about himself a lot. Most people don't spill their guts out and he is an intense starer but many people like him. My dad drove me up there and I see him lingering around a lot watching my opponent. I said we would be x amount of hours and told him when to be back to pick me up. <y dad leaves but comes back a few times within the hour to check on the weird as feth guy.

Anyways when my dad leaves the first time we talk a bit and introduce ourselves. Then he is searching for a word saying he dressed up as Darth Vader for kids in some ward of the hospital and can't remember the name. It was one of the most important aspects of his life and kept boasting about this and how much joy he brought them. I think this is cool at first but he rally really keeps boasting about this and for someone who did ti for most of his life can't seem to remember it's called the terminal ward.

I tell him "yes it's called a terminal ward" He looks at me with those fething weird eyes and stare and looks me down. He says this and I quote "I worked in the terminal ward and it emotionally devastated and destroyed my mind and soul. I've just never been the same." This is one of the first things he says about himself right after we meet him. I have extensive training in psychology but even without that I would hope this would set off alarm bells in most peoples heads at this point.

He also claims to have cancer and it kind of explains his sickly look. I give him one massive benefit of the doubt since I have no way to yet prove he is lying but I'm getting the feeling he is a compulsive liar and I start to formulate some plans to catch him in some lies. Politely to him I say its great he volunteered and I'm sorry to hear about his cancer ect.

He had a very subtle nervous tick this entire time and with his rather alarming stare its creepy and unnerving. Yet he has a sort of charm and has a few people he is acquainted with very faintly. I don't know how much they know of him but I suspect they have no idea about him.

We're about to play and the weird guy starts to talk. He says how he hates X-Wing and can't put it into words. So I ask if its the power creep and he says not really. Only a little. He hates how rigid it is. In armada he says he can take out any and all rules he wants and customize the game to the way he wants to play. He says customize it to the way he wants to play, but I get the sense he is using it to power game the system and make his own rules. We'll see how right I am soon in the farce of a first game. He makes one last backhanded comment "I don't like playing to objectives. i don't feel a game is a victory unless I kill everything and remove it form the table". Right off the bat this is the first big sign I'm at minimum dealing with a douche since eh games the system from the get go.

I put this out of my mind to focus on the game and I know I'm going to lost. So I plan with the cool old dude on my team. As I figured I didn't tell him everything about how the army was going to work. So I went for a bum rush and he went for a cautious approach.

He was a straight up cheating bastard. If I made a mistake from being rusty I let him know and he fixed the mistake to his damage or card effect ect. He knew every rule for his Imperials perfectly and also I caught him cheating with his firing arcs. He was measuring the arcs from the sides of the vessel and not like an arc. SO basically he could shoot his frontal guns almost completely behind him the way he was doing it which is ridiculous.

I point this out and he gets mad. I ask the newbie for support who is no help as he is a newbie and not sure who is right. This is actually his first game. To try and keep things friendly he makes a few "mistakes" and I catch him. I say ah this is a casual game I'll forgive ya and let him do his thing. I make a few mistakes and this is the line I get when I ask if I can just forgive them this round since I did it for him. He turns to me with anger n his face and his creepy eye stare "No. I don't do that kind of stuff for anyone. I don't let that happen." In my head I'm like then why did you accept mine if your such a rule stickler. So I caught him once more in his greed. At this point I amped up my attitude. No more mistakes. No more mercy.

He was getting rules blatantly wrong, he was rolling accuracies on his dace and he loaded his ship with as much blue as possible meaning every fething hit did tons of minimum damage. In the actual game rolling accuracies never does damage unless you have specific upgrade cards for specific effects and while he did have one of the cards it only affected blue dice and not every other dice int he game. So blatant cheating. I tell him this and look in the rules.

All game I call him on BS from the point of game face on and he looks in the rules. I am usually right but he still refuses to accept a lot of rulings and bitches when I look at the rules, but when he needs t look he gets all the time int he world. I try and look for the accuracies thing but he is impatient and its over so I resolved to let it slide until next game.

He never once fessed up to rule breaking unless caught. At this point I was starting to hide a few of my own advantages.

So he agrees to let me make a new list. And this time its 1v1. Cool old dude is not sure what happened and isn't sure who is right. I make a new list and bust out the much better list (but not the best I could have brought). It will have to do. Mon Calamri Cruiser with Ackbar and a few upgrades, rebel assault frigate, and the mon cal torpedo. Not ideal but I think I can make it work.

Cool old dude says he has to go soon but will watch until he goes. Sad I'm stuck along with the creep. He comes back in boasting about how great the Imperials are. At this point I'm beginning to dissect his mind a lot and get in there and I'm afraid. I ask him about his collection and how big it is he says this "Yeah my wife says I have a large collection of minis and have been really invested in this game." I caught him in a lie since he said he was a newbie player who had never played. I had at that point caught him lying all night and was getting a very clear idea of what I was dealing with.

I can't find the rules in time to support my firing arc claims and accuracy die so I have to play at a big disadvantage again since the star destroyers arcs are nuts the way he is playing them and he was getting impatient. I look at his list. I'm also at a big disadvantage from accuracy damage since he auto damages me every turn when he shouldn't be and accuracy effect spams me at the same time. It's definitely going to be an uphill battle. He let me make mine first and then made a counter list and metagamed it. I knew he would and he fell into my trap. Without his precious net lists he would be nothing.

I deploy the Torpedo Frigate in his face and go right up in his face and make an actual error. Should have shot at his general when I had the chance and not the ISD and would have killed it and perhaps won still would a been hard, but I had to plan for contingencies. The second mistake I had made was putting the enhanced armaments on the rebel assault frigate. Last game he had the repair station this time I have it and its surrounded by asteroids. He is an aggressive arrogant person who thinks he is always right so I figure he will charge at me like a noob and his the asteroids and debris fields. My third and biggest mistake was putting my rebel assault frigate on the right too far away form the action where it didn't shoot once all game. If I had not made that mistake I would have beat his cheating ass. But I was rusty from not playing for six months or if I had my uber list I would have taken him down or if he had not been a cheating bastard.

He still didn't want to play to objectives (gee I wonder why).

The torpedo suicide runs him and does outstanding damage to him and he is getting mad. I see hi face change into this horrific face of anger and rage while i'm chill. He can't believe this is happening. Then it moves off the board and is gone. I even get a little cocky myself "Typical Imperial Doctrine". The next few turns proceed with me dishing out more damage than his vaunted ISD, transport, and talking can mitigate. If I had the gunnery teams here and more support cards it would have been over by turn 4. My Mon Cal has also taken a beating and my rebel frigate is a non factor since he is too far. I'm a few damage away from dying.

Cool Old Dude is still here and watching. I bro fist him and he laughs and say rebel tactics are prevailing. Then the freaking cavalry arrives his own acquaintances show up to play Armada too and they are rules veterans. Quite quickly they all take my side of the rules debates, but I'm in a bad spot due to my own tactical blunders. Still some of the damage had been done by the cheating and could not be so easily removed since it had been so long ago. My Mon Cal goes up a lot of wounds and shields and he is starting to shake and get angry and his tick is getting worse.

I let this line drop "I'm definitely not leaving the store without buying something today since I really need to update my army." This makes him mad and he look me in the eye with the same creepy stare.

With the fire arcs on my side me and ackbar pound the gak out of him. On turn 5 and 6 he rams through the debris fields and asteroids and takes him down to 1 health. His fighters came boba gett and other heros and take me out. He ISD was one wound from death and he was real worried. If my rebel frigate had survived the fighter swarm it would have gotten it and all his vaunted power and then I would have won if not for time limits being off. As it was he rigged all the games from the start.

He calms down and says that was all according to plan. I call him on his BS and said you didn't expect most of that to happen since you veered into the asteroids to run away from the Ackbar Cruiser. He was really scared he was going to lose. I tell him I didn't bring my fully good list since I can't afford too much and haven't had reason to want any since no one plays me anymore.

He says I have shown him new cheese. Cool Old Dude stuck around for the whole thing and didn't seem to happy to see the donkey-cave had been fething with him all game. I'm waiting for my ride and treating this more like an interesting social experiment. He keeps creepily offering to give me and/or the old dude a ride home and we obviously don't want to be murdered so decline.

He keeps hanging around me and looking over my shoulder keeping a real good eye on me. I know he wants to see what I'm buying so he can power game next game which will never come. He says bye like 8 times and never leaves. Finally on the last time he says bye and I make sure he leaves the store and see the door shut. I wait 10 minutes and make sure he doesn't come back into the store.

I go up to buy the new Liberty Mon Cal Cruiser in stock. I go up to the counter and I hope to god I'm wrong. I'm getting out my debit card and I vaguely hear the store door open. Then he is right fething behind me at the counter. He is taller than me looking right over my shoulder... "That's a very nice Liberty class cruiser your buying. Best thing you could add to your army really..." Same creepy as feth look and smile on his face. I turn around pissed off a little and give him the dirty eye to get him to back up. I hide my pin code as well since he might have also been there to look at that. He had also grabbed a pop to buy on the pretense of wanting something.

I know right fething now something is seriously wrong with this creeper and intend to investigate a lot of his claims when I get back home. He leaves the store again and I hope to god he didn't slink back in to creep me again. I tell my dad about this and as we talk about this over the next little while I begin to notice he has the behavior patterns of a sociopath. I hope to god I'm not right. I tell my dad who is experienced with the real worst of society and while he doesn't know all the scientific terms he says something about the man was off as soon as he seen him. He says he also looked like a hard core cocaine addict.

I check the guys facebook profile and it says he has only been here for a few months allegedly he moved here to marry his girlfriend. I go back to last years posts and no photos of anyone or announcements. No pictures of any girlfriends, friends, or certainly a wife or wedding planning details.

The only shred of truth the guy told me all night that I can verify is he dressed up as Darth Vader last year, but he wasn't with sick kid he was with his coke buddies according to my dad at least from their drugged out picture of them with guns and knives and one in a clown costume from last year I have to agree he is extremely creepy as feth.

Instantly unfriend him, leave all the FLGS groups I'm in since he could see me there, block his ass, and tell everyone I know about him to watch out for him. No one at the gameshelf knows much about the guy either and he rarely shows up or talks much.

I don't treat these a a loss. I don't even treat these farces as a game. He is one fethed up person who creeps me out. The way he tried to almost hug me from behind at the counter and look over my shoulder was the creepiest moment of my life so far by far.

Anyone got some bad stories to top this. There's more tiny details I'm forgetting more lies and rule breaking but suffice to say I think I've given it enough justice. So anyone got a more fethed up story? >

He also kept trying to ask where me and the cool old dude lived. I didn't tell him much but if I had known what I had from the start I would not have even said that.

The same day I went to this flgs a little before the opponent showed up I was talking to a Tyranids player and his friends and hitting it off. We were talking about the new GSC and I was complimenting his paint job on his regular Nids and mentioning how my friend also plays nids. Then I mentioned I play Tau and then he says "My Tyranids don't like you. I don't like Tau." Then he and the rest of them wouldn't talk to me anymore.

Suffice to say I'm not keen on going back to this "friendly" flgs to play games and it's the only one that is close to me like an hour across the city. It costs a lot of money for me to get in to the town and I'm not rich so it took a lot of planning and cash to get into town for this one day and my first day ever. I do know the owners of the store and they seem like the only nice humans in there and they give me discounts on a lot of stuff since I'm such a frequent customer. If it wasn't for that I probably would start shopping online more.

There are only two other flgs in my town and even further drives. One of them the owner hates my guts. I went there when I was younger and he seen that I was a kid and had no idea what kind of money I had or anything. I was looking at the newest edition of 40k Core Rules. It might have even been the collectors edition (I was a 40k noob at the time) but was interested in getting started. I asked him why the book was so expensive in a kind of joking way. Then he looks at my clothes and my dad who is a rough outdoors men type and not the richest looking guy and says "You need to be a rich person to be able to buy this." I don't think it occurred to him that I had enough money to buy it on me and was just trying to start up a conversation. So I left the store that very instant me and my dad. I went back there a few years after again to try and get an anime dvd and he was just as rude again. I don't know what he has against me but my friend gets along with him great apparently.
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BetrayTheWorld
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PostSubject: Re: gangs of Commorragh!?   Mon Dec 26 2016, 04:09

Is this your post? Because it all sounds a bit overcritical of other people, if you ask me. Stories like this are why I generally won't play games against random minors at game stores. I'm in my 30's, and wouldn't want some awful, inconsiderate kid spreading rumors about me just because I was friendly with him and asked him small-talk questions about his life(school, neighborhood, etc).

If that is your story, you should think about how you reacted. Maybe he really does have cancer and that's why he looks wierd. Maybe he was wearing a wig or something. Maybe his eyes bulged a bit because his face was emaciated from chemo treatments. My sister died of cancer.

If you have a problem with him for cheating and want to vent about it, that's one thing, but half of that text kept making allusions to the way he looks, him being old, or automatic assumptions that he's some kind of pervert/criminal, based on your own determination that he's a "creeper". You could have talked about a guy cheating without saying anything about the way he looks and had your story fit in like 6 lines in a paragraph.(hyperbole)

Let me tell you something: Older guys don't post every life event on facebook. We're from a generation before the internet or cellphones even existed. Half of us don't even have facebook. If you researched my facebook, you wouldn't see leadup to me getting married either, but that doesn't mean it didn't happen. Also, when an older guy who is single and has some money decides to get into a hobby like 40k, we can afford to buy an entire 2 thousand dollar army off of ebay in one go. We may have the time to spend 50-100 hours studying the game through reading and watching videos before we ever play our first game. This was the case with me when I started playing 40k, and I won my first 10 games I ever played. None of my first 10 opponents had any idea I was new, though I did make some mistakes that they may have thought was me trying to slip one past them. But despite all that, I WAS a newbie.

I had a pretty vast knowledge of the rules because I spent TONS of hours reading books and watching videos, but I had no actual play experience at all. So it might have seemed strange to people when I'd recall tons of obscure wordings in the books that seasoned players didn't know about, but forget a basic movement rule. That's the sort of thing that makes opponents THINK you're cheating, but it can be a perfectly innocent mistake.

I don't know who wrote this, but I think they should think about their entire experience again, while specifically giving these people the benefit of the doubt, and see if they think it's possible they were wrong. Whoever wrote that sounds very judgemental and immature to me. In this hobby, you need to learn to give opponents the benefit of the doubt, or you'll be that miserable guy that has perfect strategy, but who's dice always fail him, who can't ever find an opponent who isn't playing cheese, and who is banned or otherwise unable/unwilling to attend any of the 3 FLGS in driving distance due to personal problems with people there.

I don't mean any offense with any of this, and hope you take none. I'm asking you to be sensitive to other people's situations and not make assumptions about them to, hopefully, improve your own life.

No. Don't take rides from old strangers who offer. But also don't run around on social media calling the guy a creeper/cheater/serial killer for being what you considered overly friendly. In some countries, you might have been kissed on the cheek when he met you. People from different places, even within our own country, act differently due to cultural differences. That's compounded by age differences, with younger people not realizing things like sometimes older people, who aren't necessarily "rich" are still able to just plop down 2 grand for a hobby that they're new, but well-studied on.

The guy could have been a creeper. He could have been a murderer. He could have been a cheater. But you didn't have enough information to know that. He might have just been a sick, dying old man who was trying to be nice while simultaneously playing a competitive game where you two had some rule interpretation disputes. It happens. Give people a break.

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Xivai
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PostSubject: Re: gangs of Commorragh!?   Mon Dec 26 2016, 04:33

Somehow I knew you would say that. Anyways cya.
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Painjunky
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PostSubject: Re: gangs of Commorragh!?   Mon Dec 26 2016, 07:50

Anyway... back on topic... I hope its a supp and not a stand alone game cos its very hard to find ppl who want to play these little boxed games.
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