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 A place for Eldrad's sprue and Cheap Harlequins

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Count Adhemar
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PostSubject: Re: A place for Eldrad's sprue and Cheap Harlequins   Mon Aug 08 2016, 08:35

@CurstAlchemist wrote:
As cast of players says Eldar and Dark Eldar Factions I would say that CWE, Harlequins, Corsairs, Dark Eldar and Haemonculus Covens all get the crusader rules when within their bubble. I'm taking this interpretation because it doesn't specifically state Craftworld now does it state codex but factions.

I can't see that one washing with too many people. Codex: Craftworlds says "All of the units described in this book have the Eldar Faction". Similarly, the Doom of Mymeara books says "All of the units presented in this army list are of the Eldar Corsairs Faction" and goes on to say that "The Eldar Corsairs army list is a complete and separate faction of the Eldar race".

Haemonculus Covens however are certainly Dark Eldar as they share the same faction (denoted by a symbol at the top of their datasheets) as the Codex: Dark Eldar units.

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CurstAlchemist
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PostSubject: Re: A place for Eldrad's sprue and Cheap Harlequins   Mon Aug 08 2016, 08:41

@Count Adhemar I stand corrected. So basically, because it states that the Harlequins are Harlequin Faction, they cannot get crusader by being within the bubble.

Guess this has derailed a bit...


Last edited by CurstAlchemist on Mon Aug 08 2016, 08:45; edited 1 time in total
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Count Adhemar
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PostSubject: Re: A place for Eldrad's sprue and Cheap Harlequins   Mon Aug 08 2016, 08:44

@CurstAlchemist wrote:
@Count Adhemar I stand corrected. So basically, because it states that the Harlequins are Harlequin Faction, they cannot get crusader by being within the bubble.

Strange but true. Craftworlds, DE and Covens units get it but nobody else does, apart from the models in the formation itself.

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CurstAlchemist
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PostSubject: Re: A place for Eldrad's sprue and Cheap Harlequins   Mon Aug 08 2016, 08:46

Got to love GW and their rule writing team, I understand not mentioning Corsairs as they are a forgeworld supplement but to ignore their own faction is just a bit of a joke.
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Count Adhemar
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PostSubject: Re: A place for Eldrad's sprue and Cheap Harlequins   Mon Aug 08 2016, 08:58

The ridiculous restrictions on virtually all Harlequin units and formations really puts me off buying any. Was hoping that the Death Masque stuff would be a way to play these beautiful models without the silly restrictions but if anything it's made them worse.

And still no bloody HQ!!

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lelith
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PostSubject: Re: A place for Eldrad's sprue and Cheap Harlequins   Mon Aug 08 2016, 10:00

@Squidmaster wrote:
There's nothing stopping you from using the new guys in a Masque detachment, because they're still Harlequin faction.
If we're talking RAW, then the Masque doesn't say that all units in it "must be from this Codex", it just says they must have the Harlequin faction. Which the new guys do.

Ah, that's right. Simple and easy. Thanks!

I'm considering a psychic-oriented harlequin army now, with Ulthran and 3-4 shadowseers. Not sure of its competitiveness though Sad Just for fun!

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PostSubject: Re: A place for Eldrad's sprue and Cheap Harlequins   Mon Aug 08 2016, 10:05

I can only see one good unit, the Death Jester... Shrouding is great for the regular Harlequins list. The rest seems crap.

90p for a Voidweaver? What increased the price so much? It was overpriced to start with...

I can't remeber how the new transport rules affect these units, could you get a regular Masque formation, buy 2 Fast Attack empty Starweavers and deploy the Harlequins from this new formation in them? Or do they have to start on foot and then embark turn one?

I get it to 770p for the Coherian Host, you could get this one and a regular Masque and maybe get a cool army together, Eldrads buffs will be really useful, I can see him running around with the Company of the Threefold Stranger and the Inriam's Spectre...
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PostSubject: Re: A place for Eldrad's sprue and Cheap Harlequins   Mon Aug 08 2016, 10:10

If you bring starweavers from fast slot, you can start a game embarking the vehicle.

I'm not sure of that idea though, cause you gotta pay a HUGE tax to bring these starweavers, e.g., 3 another units of troupes as well as the notorious voidweaver.

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Causalis
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PostSubject: Re: A place for Eldrad's sprue and Cheap Harlequins   Mon Aug 08 2016, 10:16

Quick question: Where can we find the rules for the Death Masque? Are they in the box or are they separate like the Deathwatch Codex?
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PostSubject: Re: A place for Eldrad's sprue and Cheap Harlequins   Mon Aug 08 2016, 10:34

They're in the box.
Which hasn't technically been released yet.
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Imateria
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PostSubject: Re: A place for Eldrad's sprue and Cheap Harlequins   Mon Aug 08 2016, 11:45

I'd like to point out that there is only one formation in this box, the coherian host, everything else is a unit entry data sheet, they just have fancy names and a pre-set loadout. That means you can easily include any of them (other than Eldrad, since he's still Craftworld Eldar) in a Masque detachment as they'll take up either a troop, elite, fast attack or heavy support slot.

Deathstorm had the exact same thing with the Spawn of Cryptus and the Beast of Phodia being a specific Broodlord and Carnifex.
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PostSubject: Re: A place for Eldrad's sprue and Cheap Harlequins   Mon Aug 08 2016, 11:51

@Count Adhemar wrote:
The ridiculous restrictions on virtually all Harlequin units and formations really puts me off buying any. Was hoping that the Death Masque stuff would be a way to play these beautiful models without the silly restrictions but if anything it's made them worse.

And still no bloody HQ!!

I know, I know. I really wanted to buy this but I just cant. With these rules its just not worth it.

Ill save my cash for 8th ed. Rolling Eyes
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PostSubject: Re: A place for Eldrad's sprue and Cheap Harlequins   Mon Aug 08 2016, 11:54

Actually the spectre seems to fit CWE or DE better than harlequins. The irony of Cegorach!

I never want a power game, but someone may be interested in dark reapers or wraithguards with 2+ cover.

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Count Adhemar
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PostSubject: Re: A place for Eldrad's sprue and Cheap Harlequins   Mon Aug 08 2016, 12:03

@lelith wrote:
Actually the spectre seems to fit CWE or DE better than harlequins. The irony of Cegorach!

I never want a power game, but someone may be interested in dark reapers or wraithguards with 2+ cover.

The only way to do that is via the Cegorach's Revenge formation. The other formations with a Death Jester in them he either can't leave the unit or can't join other units!

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PostSubject: Re: A place for Eldrad's sprue and Cheap Harlequins   Mon Aug 08 2016, 12:05

What about the Masque Detachment?

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Count Adhemar
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PostSubject: Re: A place for Eldrad's sprue and Cheap Harlequins   Mon Aug 08 2016, 12:06

According to the screenshots posted earlier you can only replace the Death Jester in formations, not detachments.

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PostSubject: Re: A place for Eldrad's sprue and Cheap Harlequins   Mon Aug 08 2016, 12:19

The screenshots clarified that the he could enter Formation, but it doesn't exclude Detachments. The units are still faction: Harlequins, making them viable in any Harlequins detachment.
RAW, all units in a detachment have to be the same faction. It doesn't matter what book they come from.
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Frederick Vael
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PostSubject: Re: A place for Eldrad's sprue and Cheap Harlequins   Mon Aug 08 2016, 12:29

The dataslate gives you 2 things: first, a number of entries detailing new, unique units, with their own slot, with the spectre being an elite unit, the serpent heavy support, etc... That is, those are entries to be used on regular detachments. Second, a set of rules that allows you to use those new units on old formations, detailing how you could exchange a regular harlequin unit on one of those formations for these new units, as these new units are valid units for detachments that don't need extra rules to be introduced, but couldn't be included on older formations unless you point it out.

So you can actually pack them in both detachment and formations.
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Count Adhemar
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PostSubject: Re: A place for Eldrad's sprue and Cheap Harlequins   Mon Aug 08 2016, 12:33

@Squidmaster wrote:
The screenshots clarified that the he could enter Formation, but it doesn't exclude Detachments. The units arew still faction: Harlequins, making them viable in any Harlequins detachment.

Actually, looking at it again, I agree. Whilst formations do not include detachments, the Harlequin Masque detachment just specifies the FOC slots that are allowed, so you could take any Harlequin faction unit choice in it as long as it has the correct battlefield role. Good catch!


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PostSubject: Re: A place for Eldrad's sprue and Cheap Harlequins   Mon Aug 08 2016, 12:47

Still, there is not much to squeeze out from this new guys. Jester - sure, additional Shroud is more than welcome, especially since it's only 5 points difference. Maybe new Skyweavers can be useful, at least my friend who play space marines just jammed this argument to my face (re-roll of jink is cool bro, all Raverwing is built on it, blah-blah), both Tropues have nice bonus but they can't be upgraded anyway, and Voidweaver is still a Voidweaver, so, nothing that special.
But we can actually find some usage in this poor clowns.

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PostSubject: Re: A place for Eldrad's sprue and Cheap Harlequins   Mon Aug 08 2016, 12:52

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PostSubject: Re: A place for Eldrad's sprue and Cheap Harlequins   Mon Aug 08 2016, 13:00

Serpent's Breath (Voidweaver) has BS 5 instead of 4, And that's the only stat change I think.
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PostSubject: Re: A place for Eldrad's sprue and Cheap Harlequins   Mon Aug 08 2016, 13:11

@Draco wrote:
Serpent's Breath (Voidweaver) has BS 5 instead of 4, And that's the only stat change I think.

Nice, at least something for those 15pts Smile

I guess I'll try it out. Never had any luck with the Prismatic Cannon though...
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PostSubject: Re: A place for Eldrad's sprue and Cheap Harlequins   Mon Aug 08 2016, 13:12

Has anyone seen any of the other stats? Are all named Troupe Masters stats the same as from the Codex?
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PostSubject: Re: A place for Eldrad's sprue and Cheap Harlequins   Mon Aug 08 2016, 13:19

@Draco wrote:
Serpent's Breath (Voidweaver) has BS 5 instead of 4, And that's the only stat change I think.

Nice catch! Thanks!

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