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 How to defeat the Fist of Medusa (Angels of Death)

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Akaiyou
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PostSubject: How to defeat the Fist of Medusa (Angels of Death)   Fri Jul 15 2016, 05:35

So my friend has decided to start playing Fist of Medusa Strike Force from Angels of Death supplement.

This thing gives him a crazy Feel No Pain on his Chapter Master/Captain 2+ and possibly even 1+ FNP.
It also makes the vehicles gain Machine Spirit which is brutal on Vindicators.

My Dark Eldar got crushed last week fighting this ungodly thing, I tossed Soul Grinders at it to negate the FNP roll altogether but still lost the game (it was close though) but on the second game I had already picked a list with Astra Militarum allies using Cadia's Emperor's Blade formation with a LOT of flamers...and well I surrendered after turn 3, realizing I had no hope of ever killing these nigh-immortal space marines. My flamer-heavy list went up in flames....

So I went back to the drawing board and our next game day (next week) I plan on using a pure Dark Eldar list and also some Dark Eldar + Tyranid Allies list and toss MCs at these superman marines while the scheming DE sneak around and nab untis on the exterior far away from the carnage.

So I'll show you the last list I played against when I had my very dead IG slaves. And if you guys can provide some solid ideas or tactics to use this type of list that'd be awesome. My opponent has a lot of dirty tricks up his bag but i'm positive he will keep using Fist of Medusa until i find some sort of hard counter to it.

Fist of Medusa Strike Force
Formation:
  1 Armoured Task Force, 470 pts

     1 Techmarine (Bolt Pistol; Power Axe)
        1 Thunderfire Cannon
           1 Techmarine Gunner
        1 Vindicator
        1 Vindicator
        1 Whirlwind
Formation:
  1 Battle Demi-Company, 729 pts

     1 Captain (Bolt Pistol; Artificer Armour; Thunder Hammer x1; Digital Weapons, The Gorgon's Chain, Space Marine Bike)
     4 Command Squad (Equip with Space Marine Bikes)
        1 Apothecary (Space Marine Bike)
     5 Tactical Squad
        1 Sergeant (Bolt Pistol; Boltgun)
     4 Tactical Squad
        1 Sergeant (Bolt Pistol; Boltgun)
     4 Tactical Squad
        1 Sergeant (Bolt Pistol; Boltgun)
     1 Attack Bike Squad
     4 Devastator Squad (Heavy Bolter x1; Missile Launcher x2)
        1 Sergeant (Bolt Pistol; Boltgun)
Formation:
  1 Storm Wing, 430 pts

     1 Stormraven Gunship (Twin-Linked Lascannon; Twin-Linked Multi-melta)
     1 Stormtalon Gunship (Skyhammer Missile Launcher)
     1 Stormtalon Gunship (Skyhammer Missile Launcher)

Imperial Knight Detachment:
  1 Knight Errant [KNI], 370 pts

Total Roster Cost: 1999

If you want to see the lists Im currently plan on using against this, and possibly offer advice check them out here:
Dark Eldar + Officio Assassinorum
http://www.thedarkcity.net/t14153-2000-combined-arms-detachment-assassins#163398

Dark Eldar + Tyranids (Devourers)
http://www.thedarkcity.net/t14151-2000-cad-de-hive-fleet-detachment-devourers#163395

Dark Eldar + Tyranids (Hierodule)
http://www.thedarkcity.net/t14152-2000-cad-de-hive-fleet-detachment-hierodule
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The_Burning_Eye
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PostSubject: Re: How to defeat the Fist of Medusa (Angels of Death)   Fri Jul 15 2016, 08:58

The most efficient way of killing that captain is to D-slap him outta there - he doesn't get feel no pain against stuff that causes instant death. A friend of mine uses him a lot and a few times he's come up against knights stomping him to death. Alternatively, it's a lot of points to put into a single unit so if you can tie it up with something then you're making a big impact on his ability to score points.

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Count Adhemar
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PostSubject: Re: How to defeat the Fist of Medusa (Angels of Death)   Fri Jul 15 2016, 09:29

WWP an Archon with a unit of D-Scythe Wraithguard next to his Captain and see how they like it Smile Added bonus that they can do a job on his Knight too if they live that long.

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Akaiyou
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PostSubject: Re: How to defeat the Fist of Medusa (Angels of Death)   Fri Jul 15 2016, 10:41

So the solution is basically ally Eldar? lol I really wish that wasn't always the solution to DE woes.
I actually have 15 wraithguard and it's soooooo the obvious go to answer for a LOT of issues. But i'm trying to avoid Eldar allies at all cost, there has to be something else we can use! So far ive had a decent record with DE scoring many wins and some losses, I feel like there has to be something...no?
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Count Adhemar
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PostSubject: Re: How to defeat the Fist of Medusa (Angels of Death)   Fri Jul 15 2016, 11:06

@Akaiyou wrote:
So the solution is basically ally Eldar? lol I really wish that wasn't always the solution to DE woes.
I actually have 15 wraithguard and it's soooooo the obvious go to answer for a LOT of issues. But i'm trying to avoid Eldar allies at all cost, there has to be something else we can use! So far ive had a decent record with DE scoring many wins and some losses, I feel like there has to be something...no?

Well, the only thing that's going to bypass that FNP is S10, which we don't have, D-Weapons, which we don't have or Instant Death (which doesn't inflict ID due to Eternal Warrior but still bypasses the FNP). So if you want to stay within the DE codex then you need to look at flooding him with attacks that cause ID, which basically means Grots (and hope for 6's). The downside to Grots being that against T5 they only wound on a 4+ and don't get to re-roll for poison.


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The_Burning_Eye
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PostSubject: Re: How to defeat the Fist of Medusa (Angels of Death)   Fri Jul 15 2016, 11:29

@Count Adhemar wrote:
@Akaiyou wrote:
So the solution is basically ally Eldar? lol I really wish that wasn't always the solution to DE woes.
I actually have 15 wraithguard and it's soooooo the obvious go to answer for a LOT of issues. But i'm trying to avoid Eldar allies at all cost, there has to be something else we can use! So far ive had a decent record with DE scoring many wins and some losses, I feel like there has to be something...no?

Well, the only thing that's going to bypass that FNP is S10, which we don't have, D-Weapons, which we don't have or Instant Death (which doesn't inflict ID due to Eternal Warrior but still bypasses the FNP). So if you want to stay within the DE codex then you need to look at flooding him with attacks that cause ID, which basically means Grots (and hope for 6's). The downside to Grots being that against T5 they only wound on a 4+ and don't get to re-roll for poison.


He'd also get his 2+ armour against those wounds.

D-scythes won't be the answer soon though anyway will they cos the draft FAQ is making them count as S4 for that purpose?

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Count Adhemar
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PostSubject: Re: How to defeat the Fist of Medusa (Angels of Death)   Fri Jul 15 2016, 11:39

@The_Burning_Eye wrote:
D-scythes won't be the answer soon though anyway will they cos the draft FAQ is making them count as S4 for that purpose?

I think that only applies for the No Escape rule.

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The Red King
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PostSubject: Re: How to defeat the Fist of Medusa (Angels of Death)   Fri Jul 15 2016, 14:29

They already are strength 4 for the purposes of instant death but that's apropos to nothing in this case as D weapons specifically disallow fnp which I think is the goal.

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Jimsolo
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PostSubject: Re: How to defeat the Fist of Medusa (Angels of Death)   Fri Jul 15 2016, 16:14

@The Red King wrote:
They already are strength 4 for the purposes of instant death but that's apropos to nothing in this case as D weapons specifically disallow fnp which I think is the goal.

Yep. Baby D is still D.
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BetrayTheWorld
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PostSubject: Re: How to defeat the Fist of Medusa (Angels of Death)   Fri Jul 15 2016, 18:27

@The Red King wrote:
They already are strength 4 for the purposes of instant death but that's apropos to nothing in this case as D weapons specifically disallow fnp which I think is the goal.

Yeah, D-weapons specifically disallow FnP, even if said D-weapon counts as S4 for instant death purposes.(And D-weapons still generally do D3 AP2 wounds per hit, regardless)

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Akaiyou
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PostSubject: Re: How to defeat the Fist of Medusa (Angels of Death)   Fri Jul 15 2016, 21:26

Lol damn i have no grotesques i'm screwed. Did any of you check out the lists i'm planning to field against this monstrosity?

I didnt see any comments on any of the threads so i've been curious.

I am using Assassins and Tyranids as allies.

In the list with Assassins the Vindicare ignores cover, has ammo that ignores invulnerables, and the gun is AP2. Meaning that I could try and snipe the apothecary and then the captain/chapter master. Have any of you tried this before?

For fluff reasons the DE are raiding a renegade marine camp, and assassins are dispatched to kill the 'leaders' of the renegade chapter amist the chaos.

On the other front the lists with Tyranids is the potential to tarpit, SMASH, and be a tough nuisance with several MCs. The hierodule is also gargantuan so there's always that.

Fluff wise, the DE decide to raid space marines while they are embroiled in a heavy war with Tyranids.
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fisheyes
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PostSubject: Re: How to defeat the Fist of Medusa (Angels of Death)   Fri Jul 15 2016, 23:42

One thing you have going for you is the lack of grav. Maybe try some talos (ID) or a DA?
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Akaiyou
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PostSubject: Re: How to defeat the Fist of Medusa (Angels of Death)   Sat Jul 16 2016, 02:52

He used grav against my DE in our initial games and found that it was terrible against my armour save lol then he removed it form his list.
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fisheyes
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PostSubject: Re: How to defeat the Fist of Medusa (Angels of Death)   Sat Jul 16 2016, 11:19

I would recomend the DA formation, but i have no clue what the knight may do to it. Its possible the DA could just get stomped off the board if your not careful.

Anyone have experience vs a knight?
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PostSubject: Re: How to defeat the Fist of Medusa (Angels of Death)   Tue Jul 19 2016, 17:01

Knights actually aren't that bad for Dark Eldar, assuming you have enough dark light and haywire

I'd say play the mission, use mobility and hide behind line of sight blocking terrain as much as possible, run lots of MSU. I'd consider putting a good chuck of the Army in reserve.

Most importantly don't waste fire power on a unit you realistically can't hurt, take out the thunderfire cannon ASAP, the vindicators are also high priority after that the main job is going to be to pick off the small tactical marines while keeping the majority of your force away from his captain.

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