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 [2000] - Dark Eldar - Combined Arms - Wyches

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Akaiyou
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PostSubject: [2000] - Dark Eldar - Combined Arms - Wyches   Tue Apr 19 2016, 00:34

Played my first game with Dark Eldar vs Tau. It was a gruelling battle and I ultimately lost the game after leading for 3 full turns. I forgot some rules and fumbled through some of the tips received as far as game play. Any how I want to try out running a wych-eccentric list. I want some list advice but more importantly play tactics and advice anywhere from set up to wrap up.

Caveats for the list in order of importance:
#1 - Wyches. I want to use all of the wyches I own all 40 of them in the list and I'd like to keep them equipped as they already are, since I don't really feel like breaking arms off since I lack bits to replace things with.

#2 - Succubus, I really like the idea of the succubus and want to keep both. I went as far as to convert the second one because I think it's "KEWL" and very fitting for a Wych Cult.

#3 - Incubi, my favorite dark eldar models and while not as important as the first 2 items I do want to keep them involved here if possible to make a working list around the whole thing that includes all my incubi.


Here is the current list I built up for wyches:

2000 Pts - Codex: Dark Eldar Roster - 2000 - CAD - Wyches

: Combined Arms Detachment (71#, 2000 pts)
  1 Succubus, 115 pts (Splinter Pistol; Archite Glaive; Haywire Grenades; The Armour of Misery)

  1 Succubus, 120 pts (Splinter Pistol; Archite Glaive; Haywire Grenades; The Animus Vitae)

  5 Incubi, 175 pts
     1 Raider (Dark Lance x1; Night Shields)

  5 Incubi, 175 pts
     1 Raider (Dark Lance x1; Night Shields)

  10 Wyches, 190 pts (Splinter Pistol & CCW x7; Hydra Gauntlets (x2) x3)
     1 Raider (Dark Lance x1; Night Shields)

  10 Wyches, 190 pts (Splinter Pistol & CCW x7; Shardnet & Impaler x3)
     1 Raider (Dark Lance x1; Night Shields)

  10 Wyches, 190 pts (Splinter Pistol & CCW x7; Shardnet & Impaler x3)
     1 Raider (Dark Lance x1; Night Shields)

  10 Wyches, 190 pts (Splinter Pistol & CCW x7; Shardnet & Impaler x3)
     1 Raider (Dark Lance x1; Night Shields)

  5 Scourges, 120 pts (Shardcarbine x1; Haywire Blaster x4)

  5 Scourges, 120 pts (Shardcarbine x1; Haywire Blaster x4)

  1 Talos, 135 pts (Chain-flails; TL Haywire Blaster)

  1 Ravager, 140 pts (Dark Lance x3; Night Shields)

  1 Ravager, 140 pts (Dark Lance x3; Night Shields)

Total Roster Cost: 2000


I'll be facing off against Tau and Imperial Guard most likely. Thoughts?


Last edited by Akaiyou on Tue Apr 26 2016, 20:01; edited 1 time in total
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BetrayTheWorld
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PostSubject: Re: [2000] - Dark Eldar - Combined Arms - Wyches   Tue Apr 19 2016, 04:08

You've unfortunately just asked for tactical and list advice with the stipulation that you'd want to to use 40 of the least recommended models in the book. If you're looking for honest tactical/listbuilding advice, mine is simple: Don't.

I have 60 wyches sitting on a shelf that haven't left said shelf since our most recent codex release, because they're just not good for their price right now, in pretty much any way.

If, rather than looking to be as competitive as possible, you're just looking to use the models you have, and have fun, my advice changes to: Great list! Play it and let us know how it goes! Very Happy

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Akaiyou
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PostSubject: Re: [2000] - Dark Eldar - Combined Arms - Wyches   Tue Apr 19 2016, 04:34

well I understand what you are implying but the way i see it, if you are planning to join an F1 race with a Honda Civic. It's clear you have no chance in hell of winning that race, but the question is not 'how do i win the race' its a matter of 'how do i get the most out this Honda Civic?'

So yeah I got wyches...now what can I do to fine tune it and get the most mileage out of it?
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hydranixx
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PostSubject: Re: [2000] - Dark Eldar - Combined Arms - Wyches   Tue Apr 19 2016, 06:47

Play them as Lhameans instead, and run two Cads with two units of 10 Lhameans each Very Happy

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fisheyes
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PostSubject: Re: [2000] - Dark Eldar - Combined Arms - Wyches   Tue Apr 19 2016, 12:27

For what its worth, I second hydranixx. Use them as lhameans, as they can actually kill stuff.

If your set on using the wyches as wyches, how about a beast-pack to help rush up for target priority saturation? S4 with 5A on the charge is nothing to laugh at.

Also, what is with all the lances? Couldent you give your wyches hywire nades?
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Akaiyou
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PostSubject: Re: [2000] - Dark Eldar - Combined Arms - Wyches   Tue Apr 19 2016, 14:09

whats bad about having dark lances on multiple platforms?
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BetrayTheWorld
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PostSubject: Re: [2000] - Dark Eldar - Combined Arms - Wyches   Tue Apr 19 2016, 21:16

@fisheyes wrote:

Also, what is with all the lances? Couldent you give your wyches hywire nades?

What? Like 1 haywire grenade per unit for 15 points? No thank you.

To the OP:

Your existing list isn't bad for what you're trying to do. It's going to be weak vs. gargantuan creatures and somewhat weak vs. mech/tank-heavy armies.

That said, as long as you plan to just flat out all your vehicles into your opponents face turn 1, skipping most shooting and jinking in whatever raiders get shot at, I can see this list performing well in certain circumstances.

In our last codex, I ran a list similar to it, except it was 2 CADs with 12 units of haywire-armed wyches in dual cannon venoms, back when EACH wych in a squad could have a haywire grenade. It did well, although it was in a different meta that didn't have gargantuan creatures in normal 40k codices.

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Akaiyou
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PostSubject: Re: [2000] - Dark Eldar - Combined Arms - Wyches   Wed Apr 20 2016, 05:09

Thank you very much for the useful responses I will apply them to my next game and hopefully I'll get some perspective on the wyches afterwards
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BetrayTheWorld
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PostSubject: Re: [2000] - Dark Eldar - Combined Arms - Wyches   Wed Apr 20 2016, 05:43

Good luck and let us know how you do! I love hearing about wyches doing good! Very Happy

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PostSubject: Re: [2000] - Dark Eldar - Combined Arms - Wyches   Tue Apr 26 2016, 19:59

Got to play this list yesterday. My second game ever with Dark Eldar, after being defeated in a long drawn out fight on my first game vs Tau. Here are the Tau once again up to no good.

Mission: Contact Lost
Deployment: Hammer and Anvil
Night Fighting: Turn 1
First Turn: Dark Eldar

I don't recall the TOs i generated through the game i'll make a note of them next time I do a report like this. But my starting TO was an easy one to achieve by taking Objective #1, which I could do immediately. The Tau set up very very confidently after nearly tabling the Dark Eldar on their first encounter. Tau infiltrated with several stealth suits in ruins, pathfinders in ruins and crisis teams lurking about outside of line of sight behind ruin walls. Kroot were in the forest and a lone piranha was near them eager to rush up and fusion blast my vehicles to hell and back. Commander Fargsight with a team of crisis suits were held in reserve.









TURN 1

I am disappointed that the Tau only had 1 vehicle and it was a piranha, making me feel like my scourges were going to be completely useless. So I moved the scourges to get within range of it, and shoot it down for first blood. Which I succesfully accomplished. The ravagers without any good targets to shoot at just prowl about and take some pot shots but accomplish very little. All the raiders move and then flat out to the right side. I figure that is his strongest side and if i can overwhelm him on turn 2 that the game will be mine. So all 6 raiders went full speed to the right side. I lost 2 raiders and one of my incubi+succubus units was also wiped out by massed burstcannon fire.

TURN 2

It sucked seeing my incubi go away like that, but the retaliation would be swift, vengeance would be delivered cold and drawn out to savor every moment. I disembarked all the wyches, and moved the raiders combat speed into position to shoot at the crisis teams that had been trying to sneak on by. I positioned the remaining scourges to declare charges first and take the overwatch head on so that the wyches can get in without a scratch. The Raiders with Dark Lances + Ravagers destroy a full unit of crisis suits with respective drones. The wyches take out a unit of pathfinders and a unit of stealth suits.

The Victory Point score total is 4-1 in the favor of the Dark Eldar. The tau having not expected such deadly retribution and unable to summon their reserves, are left to flee and try to fight back forgoing the mission entirely in a plan for survival.










TURN 3

The wyches are getting stronger as power from pain begins to take effect and they continue to assault and kill more of the Tau until all that remains are the kroot and 1 lone stealth suit. The tau on the other hand are still without back up as Farsight sat at this desk reviewing the army composition and shaking his head that there were not enough crisis teams on the field. The Dark Eldar take a giant 9-1 lead.

TURN 4

I offer my opponent the chance to concede. As it looks like I will potentially table him if things carry on. He declines and wants to see if it can happen. I foolishly fall for this Tau trickery and half ass my strategy expecting to table him easily. The Kroot proved to be further out that I originally calculated and I essentially wiff the entire next turn. Farsight finally arrives but makes a rather silent entry killing only a small band of wyches and huddling up behind a ruined wall protecting objective 6. My succubus warlord and her incubi retinue saw this and saw great opportunity.

TURN 5

With farsight beliving himself to be relatively safe and the wyches rushing down the kroot with Feel No Pain, Fearless and Furious Charge aswell as Combat Drugs granting + Strength it was a matter of time. The succubus and incubi assaulted farsight and his friends, the weaponless commader accepted the challenge because Farsight wasn't fish enough. with a 2+ save and invulnerable the Fish Commander thought he had it made. The succubus flipped her archaite glaive to two handed mode and went to work, murdering the commander with ease and killing a few of his friends aswell. But the incubi put 9 AP2 wounds on the unit to seal the deal. Game Over.











WINNER: Dark Eldar
Final Score: 13-1
MVP: Incubi
Worthy Mention: Raiders, Dark Lances
Least Useful: Talos (did nothing all game...got close and failed every charge, never getting closer than 7" from the enemy)


Thoughts of the wyches: They were decent, they did nothing amazing, but they did do everything i sent them out to do. They died quite easily when shot at though specially before getting feel no pain (5+). The talos was far more useless in my experience in this game, my first time using him aswell and he basically did nothing. So slow...so so slow, he couldn't catch up to anything and his gun was a threat to practically nothing. Any tips or advice for how to properly use a Talos would be appreciated.
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JayDee327
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PostSubject: Re: [2000] - Dark Eldar - Combined Arms - Wyches   Wed Apr 27 2016, 02:41

I use him as a bullet collector. Put him in the center and hope the enemy tries to take him out. Even if for one turn t7 is legit. I give him heat lances and ichor injectors. Meat shield.
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PostSubject: Re: [2000] - Dark Eldar - Combined Arms - Wyches   Wed Apr 27 2016, 05:48

I think that witches might, after all, but be that bad. You just need enough of them and throw them at the right target. Grav Centurion for example of Tau or guard if you have something to eat the overwatch.

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PostSubject: Re: [2000] - Dark Eldar - Combined Arms - Wyches   Wed Apr 27 2016, 09:23

Yeah, If your Wyches make it to CC with Centurions, they can tie them up the entire game, at a fraction of the cost of each Centurion. In fact Wyches are absolute stars against all forms of Grav. Sadly, almost all platforms that pack Grav also have bolters, which in turn are absolute starts against all forms of Wyches.

@Akaiyou you need help to survive overwatch if you're playing 40+ Wyches & 10 Incubi, especially if you're going to be against Tau quite routinely. I would consider the following two options:

Grabbing a Realspace Raider Detachment or 2 for up to 6 or 12 minimum units of Khymera to eat overwatch before charging. They're really cheap, really fast, really annoying to deal with, and surprisingly decent on their own as an add on to existing combats as well. Splitting some of the Wyches and Succubi into this detachment(s) means you won't even have to pay any tax for it except losing Objective Secured.

The other option is to take Chaos Marine Rhinos. Dirge Casters completely prevent overwatch from all enemy units within 6" of the Rhino. CSM also gives you access to 5pt flamers, and Maulerfiends/Spawn if you want additional combat beatsticks that ignore cover and reliably make turn 2 charges alongside your Wyches themselves.

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PostSubject: Re: [2000] - Dark Eldar - Combined Arms - Wyches   Wed Apr 27 2016, 13:05

This was a pretty interesting read. I don't normally read battle reports, but I wanted to see how your Wyches would do. It's nice to see them achieve a victory.

Are you going to play more games with your Wyches? If so, are you planning on changing up your list with the advice others have provided? I would like to read any other reports you do if your force progresses and evolves.

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PostSubject: Re: [2000] - Dark Eldar - Combined Arms - Wyches   Wed Apr 27 2016, 14:39

Hey i'm glad you guys enjoyed that little battle report. We played another very interesting battle after this wych list. I used Dark Eldar + Chaos Daemons, but since we started the game late evening (finishing it at 1am) I was more focused on playing than taking photos.

I conceded the game turn 5, the Tau pretty much steamrolled me in very epic fashion, I had the upperhand several times and potential to turn the tables and simply fell short each time lol it was a fun game but sheesh some times the dice gods simply aren't with you. My bloodthrister of the great axe (D weapon) made it into cc with farsight and his unit of crisis, with 2 wounds left. Had that new armor that reduces all attacks aimed at him by 1 strength, and also had Feel no Pain (4+) and some how managed to lose both his remaining wounds to a blow from farsight himself and to some unnamed crisis suit that shall be forever Sprite (Quenched my Thrist)..if only I had survived long enough to swing the mighty D...

The talos once again did nothing, lol came within 7" charge range several times and never made it to any of the confrontations.

Any how, thanks for the advice and i do agree that the wyches need something to soak up the charges. In the game I reported I used the scourges since my opponent had no tanks anyway and Haywire just isn't that useful without tanks to shoot at.

Thanks to you guys I believe I'm performing better than i ever would have on my own. A rookie in a high performance race car, eventually i'll get the hang of it.

My lists will keep changing up for the most part. So i will continue to ask for your advice when I come up with a new theme i want to try out. And if possible i'll post up battle reports like this one to show you guys how it all performed in the field.

I'm currently interested in playing Dark Eldar + Chaos Daemons combos using mono god builds of either khorne or tzeentch.
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