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 Lhamaeans - what am I missing?

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Kehmor
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PostSubject: Lhamaeans - what am I missing?   Thu Apr 14 2016, 18:46

So I was reading through this units stats and I can't help but feel they are really good for their price? They use a slot that many see as a tax in smaller lists (and in larger lists they use no slot if you take an archon). For a mere two points more than a warrior they replace their splinter rifles with a 2+ poison attack and splinter pistol and get +1 leadership to boot. How come I don't see them appearing in many lists? (Apart from one for a mandatory hq).What am I missing?
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CptMetal
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PostSubject: Re: Lhamaeans - what am I missing?   Thu Apr 14 2016, 19:13

Because they compete with Medusae and those guys rock!

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dumpeal
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PostSubject: Re: Lhamaeans - what am I missing?   Thu Apr 14 2016, 20:01

They compete with medusae for the HQ slot, and with grotesques for CC units.
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WhysoSully
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PostSubject: Re: Lhamaeans - what am I missing?   Thu Apr 14 2016, 20:42

The 3 toughness ruins any CC ability with the 2+ poison IMO. Having a cheap HQ to offset heamonculus tax on the covens formations is nice though. Also gives you a chance to take another venom with no FOC cost if I am not mistaken.

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hydranixx
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PostSubject: Re: Lhamaeans - what am I missing?   Fri Apr 15 2016, 00:30

It's better to compare Lhameans with Wyches.

Kabalites generally chill out in cover or transports taking pot shots, while both Wyches and Lhameans need to reach combat to add value and to stand a chance at living.

Lhameans are very fragile, even more so than Wyches. They can hit like a tonnes of bricks against some army types, and can fail miserably against other army types.

10 Lhameans in a Night Shield Raider set you back 170 pts:

Wraithspam? "Bring it on."
Nurgle Spawn and Nurgle biker spam? "haha!"
Nidzilla? "Please remove your entire Carnifex brood, sir."
DE Covens? "Haha what Grotesquerie?"

On the other hand, though.

10 Guardsmen? "Give me a sec while I remove 6 Lhameans in your turn to lasguns and another 2 in my turn to overwatch."

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CptMetal
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PostSubject: Re: Lhamaeans - what am I missing?   Fri Apr 15 2016, 05:28

I should convert my witches to Lheamean and give them a try.

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Kehmor
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PostSubject: Re: Lhamaeans - what am I missing?   Fri Apr 15 2016, 11:15

A position I could see them used in is perhaps a small or medium sized zoning tool for enemy multi-wound or high toughness cc units. People aren't going to want to move their groutesques (or equivelent) anywhere they might get charged by a 10 point unit that is wounding them on 2's and killing them on 6's.

I see the point about las gun fire - they certainly aren't something you could march down the middle of the field - but then neither were the wyches in the old codex. But dumping them out of line of sight near an objective or as protection for a unit you don't want getting charged seems reasonable. A unit of 5 sets you back 50 points (plus a venom that is useful anyway) and gets 15 poison 2+ attacks on the charge. Hitting on fours still means like 6 wounds/saves on the charge with 1 being instant death. Even against MEQ this is 2 unsaved wounds - at which point they've nearly paid for themselves. With a larger unit of Lham's whoever you charge might not even be in a position to retaliate.

All this assumes you aren't charging into something with initiative 6+ I guess as they certainly wouldn't last long to retaliation.
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fisheyes
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PostSubject: Re: Lhamaeans - what am I missing?   Fri Apr 15 2016, 14:11

They are definitely underused and underrated. I have been thinking of adding them to my list, but just dont get to play enough.

Please play a game with 5-10 in a squad and post a Battle Report Smile
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BetrayTheWorld
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PostSubject: Re: Lhamaeans - what am I missing?   Fri Apr 15 2016, 14:29

Do they have assault grenades? Don't have my codex with me.

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fisheyes
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PostSubject: Re: Lhamaeans - what am I missing?   Fri Apr 15 2016, 14:37

No grenades. Just a pistol, their poison CCW and basic armor.

But still not bad for 10 pts
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Skulnbonz
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PostSubject: Re: Lhamaeans - what am I missing?   Fri Apr 15 2016, 18:03

At Adepticon:
Shot a unit of seekers down to 3 models, 2 troops and a HQ choice.
Charged my single Lahmian into the two troops, the HQ was too far away to consolidate within 2".
Killed them both.
HQ died to combat res.

10 point model got 2 kill points and killed 84 points of models minimum.


Another game at Adepticon , the same Lahmean charged some T4-5 skitarri mini tanks, did three wounds, no damage in return (FNP) and ran the whole squad down.


Results may vary.

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BetrayTheWorld
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PostSubject: Re: Lhamaeans - what am I missing?   Fri Apr 15 2016, 20:42

Skulnbonz wrote:
At Adepticon:
Shot a unit of seekers down to 3 models, 2 troops and a HQ choice.
Charged my single Lahmian into the two troops, the HQ was too far away to consolidate within 2".
Killed them both.
HQ died to combat res.

10 point model got 2 kill points and killed 84 points of models minimum.


Another game at Adepticon , the same Lahmean charged some T4-5 skitarri mini tanks, did three wounds, no damage in return (FNP) and ran the whole squad down.


Results may vary.

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hydranixx
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PostSubject: Re: Lhamaeans - what am I missing?   Fri Apr 15 2016, 23:07

Kehmor wrote:
I see the point about las gun fire - they certainly aren't  something you could march down the middle of the field - but then neither were the wyches in the old codex. But  dumping them out of line of sight near an objective or as protection for a unit you don't want getting charged seems reasonable. A unit of 5 sets you back 50 points (plus a venom that is useful anyway) .

Yeah, if you play Lhamean units, they're very similar to Wyches in role and price but there are some very crucial disadvantages to Lhameans if you're treating them exactly as you would your Wyches - your Lhameans will never have Objective Secured, grenades or a 4++ in cc like Wyches, which are all quite important if you're fighting over a contested objective.

They combo very well with Sslyth, providing a LD and combat boost and getting durability in return. I've tried 2 Lhameans and 2/3 Sslyth in a Venom. It's a solid counter attack choice that doesn't instantly die when shot at and handles the HQ tax nicely.

Or you can go whole hog and play 4 or 5 of each in a Raider with a sprinkle of Night Shields and maybe Splinter Racks. It's very much an "all my eggs in one basket" approach, but it does hit stupidly hard and have decent durability.

Either way, if you do take them this way, remember to always take at least as many Sslyth as you do Lhameans so you retain T5 majority.

The best results for me with pure Lhameans (as in, 10 in a Raider Razz ) have been to find midfield cover with Night Shields, Jink like crazy if anything fires at them, and then hit combat as early as turn 2 if possible. They don't really benefit much from PfP until turn 4/5... So it's best to treat them as a semi-expendable unit that tries to eat multi-wound models, or else failing that, charge into something strong in the midfield and force a lot of armour saves.

They do far better than Wyches as long as you get to make the charge on your own terms.

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Skari
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PostSubject: Re: Lhamaeans - what am I missing?   Sat Apr 16 2016, 03:33

I love my one lhamean. She does wonders as a solo HQ taking points and keeping alive and Killing the odd thing.

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