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 Yet another homebrew codex.

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Imateria
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PostSubject: Yet another homebrew codex.   Mon Mar 28 2016, 13:29

So, I've decided to try my hand at a hombrew codex for Dark Eldar and would like peoples feedback on it.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/bb4eh38pgmtdz5y/Dark%20Eldar%20for%207th.pdf?dl=0

I've tried to put back a lot of what we lost from the 5th ed codex and tweeked the special rules for a fluffier take. Loads more options for everybody as well.

Hopefully I've rebalanced a lot of the units so that Wyches, Bloodbrides, Hellions and Wracks aren't a massive handicap anymore and our other "OK but not that great" units are more usable.

Done the obvious and raised the power level of the codex so that we at least stand a good chance against Tau, Space Marines, Necrons and Craftworld Eldar. I hope that nothing approaches the cheese level of the Scattbike/Wraithknight/Warp Spider combo though.

Added in 3 Detachment FOC's, one each for Kabals, Cults and Covens.

I had thought about doing Formations, using the 4 most often seen from the Coven suppliment (Scalpel Squadron, Dark Artisan, Corpsthiefe Claw and Grotesquerie) and coming up with 4 each for Kabal and Cult and using them for a Decurion, but apparaently my imagination doesn't stretch that far.


Last edited by Imateria on Thu Mar 31 2016, 14:40; edited 1 time in total
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PostSubject: Re: Yet another homebrew codex.   Mon Mar 28 2016, 14:37

Maybe these can serve as inspiration for wych-style formations? http://thewarmaster.com/index.php?topic=6581.0

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PostSubject: Re: Yet another homebrew codex.   Mon Mar 28 2016, 14:58

Just from some brief skim reading, I think any PfP chart really hurts without access to fast Fearless. Nothing we have is particularly brave, so I think Fearless needs to be in at number 3.

I'm not sure it would work with killing entire units because some armies play very few units - think Grey Knights - so we'd have little access to PfP when it matters if at all, and some play tonnes of little units - think MSU marines - where we could easily hit tier 5/6 on turn 2. Tallying total models killed seems better.

I do however really like Horrors of the Dark warlord trait (2).

As for melee weapons,

- I like the changes to Klaives and Archite Glaive. Gets some more cannon in our glass.
- Hellglaives with AP2? This seems way over the top, let alone the +2 strength. Even the +1 strength, ap3 version is super potent.
- Hydra Gauntlets, while its a nice idea, would get really annoying rolling d3 per gauntlet every fight phase. Probably fix it to plus 2 attacks like the old scizzorhand, and retain ap5/4.
- Djin blade seems nice, it might even see some play.

For ranged weapons,

- I like this interpretation of Darklight weapons, a lot! But Blast Pistol nerfed against to only strength 7, and still only 6"? Needs to be S8, with 12" imo.
- Disintegrators would be on crack and find a place in many lists again. Awesome to see them in the hands of Infantry, but this is very far fetched I'm afraid.
- I like the changes to Shredder, but I'd keep it strength 5 or 6, because by making it weaker strength it inadvertently enables more rerolls to wound (Shred USR) so getting 6's for that bladestorm is likelier, but overall wounding of infantry is lower.
- Voids Lances are ridiculous. Like so good there'd be few reasons to ever use the Mine... it should be small blast at the very most, and either strength 9 ap1 or strength 10 ap2. It shouldn't be as strong as a Tau Hammerhead that shoots twice and is airborne and still has extra missiles or the mine. The Void Mine itself really needs either Strength D, or ignores cover, or both.
- Stoked to see the Shattershard return. Bring the Dark Gate too! Smile

I don't like the auto included Syrabite/Hekatrix model you're using. I know that's what more recent Codexes have gone for, but I don't think it makes sense for Dark Eldar. It's also 5pts more than most of us want to pay for our Kabalites for example, and the Syrabite doesn't even take advantage of the extra BS you gave him.

I would either keep him exactly as he is now, with regular stats except ld9, and a2, maybe only costing 5 pts, or and upgrade to a pseudo Dracon for 15 pts to have the stats that Exarch's have and maybe some special rule for the squad (such as rerolling 1's to wound with poison weapons if its Kabalites, or rerolling 1's to wound in cc if he's with Wyches etc). Access to WWP is over the top though. You could drop a huge unit into play with like 4 blasters with pinpoint accuracy, then teleport back out of play. WWP either needs to be costlier and/or available only on Dracons/Archons etc.

I will read the rest of it another time, those are just my initial thoughts.

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Imateria
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PostSubject: Re: Yet another homebrew codex.   Mon Mar 28 2016, 17:48

Thanks for the feedback.

I'm generally not a fan of most armies having such easy access to Fearless as it then negates too many things. That said I could see moving it a spot or two up on the PfP table. I think with moving PfP away from being turn based and back to kill based is always going to hurt us when going against low model count elite armies, and could be even worse when counting indavidual models. If set too low it becomes OP against horde armies but if set too high the top echelons of the table become out of reach against elite armies and I don't think it can be balanced too well when in a 2K game Nids and Orks can field 150+ models and Grey Knights only 30. Could potentially throw up a lot of unwanted book keeping late game as well. Keeping it turn based negates that problem but feels too automatic and less fluffy.

Hellglaives were problematic. At first they were pretty much identical to a Power Lance. I'm now thinking sending them back to straight +1S, AP4 would be better.

Hydra Gauntlets are based on their old 5th ed profile but toned down from D6 to D3+1. Giving it a straight +2 attacks, or whatever, would certainly be a little easier but I have no trouble rolling a couple extra dice.

Thanks, I wanted to tone down the Djinn blades ability to kill your Archon and still make it usable alternative to a Huskblade.

I was 50/50 on increasing the range but since it's still a 10pt upgrade I think moving it out to 12" would be a much better idea now. As for the S level, I kind of like the idea that the Pistol is S7, the Blaster S8 and the Dark Lance/Scythe S9, kind of avoids having the weapons step on each others toes given the different units that can take them.

Disintegrators are currently discribed as exotic plasma cannons, I can't really think of a reason why infantry shouldn't take them when they can take a Dark Lance already. The only place I can see it being a problem would be Scourges, 3 guys with Grav-Wave Manipulators and Disintegrator Cannons is 105pts for 9 S6, AP2 shots on a Jet Pack Infantry platform, though they would be heavy support.  

Moving the Shredder up to S5 seems reasonable.

Void Lance/Mine. I wanted the Void weapons to be our ultimate beatstick, kind of like the Wraithcannons for Craftworlds but without going to S D. If you get your positioning right I can't see any reason why you wouldn't use the Mine. I despise small blast weapons, unless they're twin-linked or I'm firing 4+ shots at once they invariably miss and do nothing so I'd much rather keep it as a large blast weapon. Given how often our vehicles are forced to jink I don't see them being so OP.

The Dark Gate is back as well, I think I added it to Diabolical Playthings (may just roll Artefacts of Cruelty and Diabolical Playthings into a single list now).

I can understand why some people wouldn't like the auto include of sargents in most of the squads but it was something I really liked after going through the 30K red books. Can you explain what you meant by the Sybarite not being able to use his extra point of BS?

Not sure I like the idea of upgrading the Sybarite/Hekatrix to a Dracon/Syren in standard squads of Kabalites/Wyches, I just don't think it works out too well fluff wise (Your general Kabalites being the vat born DE and Trueborn being naturally born, the arrogance of the Trueborn is supposed to be a big thing with them and I just can't see a Dracon so willing fighting side by side with the commoners. Similarly with Bloodbrides they are supposed to be the best the Arena's have and the Syren's their leaders, only one step down from the Succubus and more interested in moving up than fighting with the rank and file of the Cult.). Especially since I pretty much made the Dracon and Syren Exarch equivelants to begin with (maybe I should look at giving them a special rule the same way Aspect Warrior Exarchs have).

The idea of having rainding parties jumping in and out of the webway, hitting where they're needed appealed a lot to me, hence the reason so many units have access to the WWP and that they can go back into reserve with it, maybe I should increse the cost to 30pts instead of 25.
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PostSubject: Re: Yet another homebrew codex.   Tue Mar 29 2016, 13:25

@Imateria wrote:
Void Lance/Mine. I wanted the Void weapons to be our ultimate beatstick, kind of like the Wraithcannons for Craftworlds but without going to S D. If you get your positioning right I can't see any reason why you wouldn't use the Mine.

Oh I agree with you here, that Void weapons should be our unrivaled pinnacle, but your Void Lances currently overshadow the Void Mine by a huge amount, so I think it needs some love. You can drop it once per game, or fire 2 Void Lances per turn... so yeah it's definitely weaker than them.

Adding ignores cover would go a long way towards making it the main feature of a vehicle that is, after all, literally named, a bomber. I still genuinely believe the Void Lances should be AP2 at most. I take one look at a vehicle that can offer 3 Strength10 AP1 Large Blasts in a single turn, and I can see it ruining entire armies in one round of shooting.

@Imateria wrote:
Can you explain what you meant by the Sybarite not being able to use his extra point of BS?

Consider, for a moment if you will, having to roll separately for his measly little splinter rifle every single time you want to fire at a unit with your Kabalite Warrior squad. Lets face it no one would buy a blast pistol on him, so he's sticking with his splinter rifle every time and all it would do is slow down the shooting phase even more than 7th Edition already has.

@Imateria wrote:
Not sure I like the idea of upgrading the Sybarite/Hekatrix to a Dracon/Syren in standard squads of Kabalites/Wyches, I just don't think it works out too well fluff wise.

Yeah, you might be right about this. Perhaps simply offer to upgrade one model to a standard Syrabite or Hekatrix for 10 points like we currently do, but offer some extra stats and/or rules, like an Exarch has. I think +1 ld, +1a, +1w and a nifty special rule added to his unit would be a great parallel to the Eldar Codex and a good way to make people actually WANT to play squad leaders.

@Imateria wrote:
The idea of having rainding parties jumping in and out of the webway, hitting where they're needed appealed a lot to me, hence the reason so many units have access to the WWP and that they can go back into reserve with it, maybe I should increse the cost to 30pts instead of 25.

It appeals to me a lot in a fluffy sense, but I don't think it would make for a good game when any unit can simply escape on your turn and come back next turn somewhere else without ever scattering. It would be a joke with this item on objec secured units. You could keep a cheap warlord off the table for almost the entire game to deny bonus points.

Take a look at the Corsair psychic power that puts your units into ongoing reserve for a comparison. You have to pay for the Void Dreamer (about 3 times the price of your WWP), hope he gets that specific spell, and then still you must cast it on a unit, and risk perils of the warp or deny the witch.

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PostSubject: Re: Yet another homebrew codex.   Tue Mar 29 2016, 16:27

I think I see what you mean regarding the Voidraven, though it would only get the one turn of shooting bar missiles (as long as you haven't taken the blast template missiles) anyway since even with armour 11, there will definitely be a need to jink. Ignores Cover actually makes a lot of sense on the mine, but did you notice he Resuply rule I put in? There's a good chance you'll get more than 1 use out of it per game.

People regularly run 5 Kabalites, 1 of which will have a Blaster. So now you give the Blaster, or the Shredder or Phantasm Grenade Launcher, to the Sybarite which means that special weapon has an even higher chance of hitting now. For me that would mean taking him isn't a tax but a useful include.

The Sybarite and Hekatrix are in an unusual place when comparing to Craftworlds. You can't really compare them to Exarchs because Warriors and Wyches are more like Guardians than Aspects which is why I gave the Dracon and Syren Exarch like stats since Trueborn and Bloodbrides are our equivelant of Aspects (along with Incubi, of course). For the Sybarite and Hekatrix there's no Craftworld equivelant since Guardians don't have a normal seargent upgrade but can take a Warlock, a unit that has no equivelant in the Dark Eldar fluff since they're psychic soldiers. This comes back to what I've done, given them a +1 to two of their stats as per normal for seargents, though I feel extra BS is far more useful to a Sybarite than +1 attack ever will be. As for making them auto-includes, we could go back and forth on this forever, but personally I really like the idea of units having to take their seargents and have tried to make them worthwhile and not a handicap.

A unit that has had to come in from reserve would have to spend 1 whole turn on the board before they can jump away again but I see your point, it would give the army unrivalled levels of board control and might be a bit much.
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