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The Shredder
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PostSubject: Phoenix Gem   Tue Dec 15 2015, 17:52

Does anyone use the Phoenix Gem?

If so, have you had any success with it?
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colinsherlow
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PostSubject: Re: Phoenix Gem   Tue Dec 15 2015, 19:13

It can be fun, but I prefer to keep my characters out of harms way. Or I have something more crucial to spend the points.

I can maybe see some use on the corsair prince since he seems to want to fight weaker units, but isn't overly tough. The coming back to life could be very nice since he is forced to be your warlord.


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The Shredder
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PostSubject: Re: Phoenix Gem   Tue Dec 15 2015, 19:38

colinsherlow wrote:
It can be fun, but I prefer to keep my characters out of harms way. Or I have something more crucial to spend the points.

I can maybe see some use on the corsair prince since he seems to want to fight weaker units, but isn't overly tough. The coming back to life could be very nice since he is forced to be your warlord.


Yeah, I'm looking for interesting items for a Collector of Ancient Treasures Prince to plunder, and the Phoenix Gem caught my eye.
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The Red King
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PostSubject: Re: Phoenix Gem   Tue Dec 15 2015, 20:13

Collector of ancient treasures reads as "take harlequin mask of secrets without a massive tax" to me. He can take it right? My books in the mail.

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colinsherlow
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PostSubject: Re: Phoenix Gem   Tue Dec 15 2015, 22:19

Mask of secretes is still shadowseer only. The prince can't take it

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PostSubject: Re: Phoenix Gem   Tue Dec 15 2015, 22:49

That is heartbreaking as I just ordered the book and 2 conversion kits from forgeworld...

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The Shredder
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PostSubject: Re: Phoenix Gem   Tue Dec 15 2015, 23:07

The Red King wrote:
Collector of ancient treasures reads as "take harlequin mask of secrets without a massive tax" to me.  

Well, my list doesn't contain anything that uses Ld shenanigans (excpet against my own models  Wink ), and most of the stuff I fight can't be cut down in combat; so I thought I'd look for something more interesting to snag.

I had hoped that I'd be able to take multiple items - as I'd envisioned a Corsair prince wielding 2 of the artefact pistols (Parasite's Kiss, Crescendo Kurnos' Bow). Seemed quite appropriate, really, but it seems I can't do this. Sad

colinsherlow wrote:
Mask of secretes is still shadowseer only. The prince can't take it

Are we certain about that?

I was wondering if Princes actually followed those restrictions.
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PostSubject: Re: Phoenix Gem   Wed Dec 16 2015, 00:13

Yeah. The prince can take artifacts, but he will still fallow the restrictions for them

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PostSubject: Re: Phoenix Gem   Wed Dec 16 2015, 00:16

I would be eager to hear the exact wording myself. I mean the harlequins book says a harlequin hq (paraphrasing) may take one of the following. So the prince having any of their artifacts already disregards that restriction. I would be inclined (in my biased) opinion that unless the corsair book says otherwise he can ignore that "shadowseer only" thing

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PostSubject: Re: Phoenix Gem   Wed Dec 16 2015, 00:48

2/3 of the Harlequin artifacts are so marked.  (Plus one of the Eldar ones.) Seems unlikely that he is intended to be so restricted.

Collector of Ancient Treasures does say 'any' item, which may support that.
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PostSubject: Re: Phoenix Gem   Wed Dec 16 2015, 01:08

Where do we email these questions?

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PostSubject: Re: Phoenix Gem   Wed Dec 16 2015, 01:28

The Red King wrote:
Where do we email these questions?

Email all Forgeworld/GW rules questions to nomorefaqs@pipedream.com

EDIT: The fact that TDC actually made that a hyperlink just made my year.
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PostSubject: Re: Phoenix Gem   Wed Dec 16 2015, 01:46

Thank you

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PostSubject: Re: Phoenix Gem   Wed Dec 16 2015, 02:00

Yeah, unfortunately GW has abdicated all responsibility for their game rules. Any ambiguities are left for us to suss out on our own.
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PostSubject: Re: Phoenix Gem   Wed Dec 16 2015, 02:30

Note about the differences between the mask of secretes and the armour of misery.

Mask of secretes has a -2 LD bubble to enemy "models" , whereas the Armour of misery is a -2 to enemy "units"

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PostSubject: Re: Phoenix Gem   Wed Dec 16 2015, 03:45

Indeed, and an important thing to keep in mind. If you remember it when moving/placing, you can make sure it's an irrelevant difference.
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PostSubject: Re: Phoenix Gem   Wed Dec 16 2015, 04:32

The more I think about it the less likely that the prince can not take *shadowseer, troupe master, etc. Only* items. I mean that sentence is only in the harlequin book so you don't go giving the death jester cegorach's rose or something.  Imho.

I mean it's obvious that the writers of codex:Harlequin, wrote the rules with codex harlequin in mind (arguable they even thought it through that much I know lol) so the sentence that says "shadowseer only" was definitely intended to correlate to other characters in the book who might otherwise have had access to the mask. And certainly not written with the intent of preventing interaction with an, as yet, unwritten publication by an "entirely different" rules team.

That's my two cents on the matter.

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PostSubject: Re: Phoenix Gem   Wed Dec 16 2015, 10:13

The exact wording is:

"A corsair prince with this trait may select any one item from any of the following lists, paying the noted point cost."

For me, "any" strongly suggests that, well, any item is up for grabs.
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PostSubject: Re: Phoenix Gem   Wed Dec 16 2015, 13:44

I concur.
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PostSubject: Re: Phoenix Gem   Wed Dec 16 2015, 14:34

Does that mean I could have two Armour of Misery?

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PostSubject: Re: Phoenix Gem   Wed Dec 16 2015, 14:39

CptMetal wrote:
Does that mean I could have two Armour of Misery?

Possibly, if you had multiple Corsair Princes.

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PostSubject: Re: Phoenix Gem   Wed Dec 16 2015, 16:20

No, they're still one per army, no matter who has them.

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PostSubject: Re: Phoenix Gem   Thu Dec 17 2015, 14:58

One thing that I find a little sad with Collector of Ancient Treasures is that other characters can Master Craft one of their weapons for 10pts, but the Prince who actually took the power isn't even allowed to pay for a Master Crafted weapon. Neutral

Also means this is the only power that offers no free benefit whatsoever.
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