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 I fell in love with the coven

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Drizzt23
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PostSubject: I fell in love with the coven   Sat Dec 05 2015, 01:33

I never expected To fall in love so much with it but the coven of flesh touched my very soul and it's driving me insane. What is your favorite formation and why? My 2 best at the moment would be the grotesquerie (they had me just with the name) and the corpsethief claw.
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Nariaklizhar
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PostSubject: Re: I fell in love with the coven   Sat Dec 05 2015, 02:20

Dark Artisan. I reserve my entire army except for the DA. With help from my Autarch, I come in turn 2 or 3 and hit my opponent hard when and where I want to. Wouldn't be able to do it without my trusty Dark Artisan.
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stilgar27
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PostSubject: Re: I fell in love with the coven   Sat Dec 05 2015, 03:21

That's it really, the dark artisan, grotesquerie, and corpsthief claw are effective and fairly well thought out. If the rest of the dark eldar book (or even just the coven's one) were as effective and interesting I'm pretty sure there would be more dark eldar players.
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CptMetal
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PostSubject: Re: I fell in love with the coven   Sat Dec 05 2015, 06:50

I use the grotesquerie and plan on using the scalpel for null deployment.
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Mushkilla
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PostSubject: Re: I fell in love with the coven   Sat Dec 05 2015, 19:36

I don't use any of the formations, just the detachment which I find gives me a bit more freedom. The formations do kick ass though.

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The Shredder
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PostSubject: Re: I fell in love with the coven   Sat Dec 05 2015, 20:27

I liked Coven a while ago, but my enthusiasm for it has dwindled since then. I thought that having their own item selection might make Haemoncului actually worth a damn. Nope. Also, playing against GKs about 70% of the time probably didn't help.

Still, I might try them again soon as allies for my Corsairs.

Anyway, in terms of favourite formations:

- Covenite Fleshcorps. Yeah, Wracks suck more than every vacuum on Earth combined, but somehow I still like (well, liked) this formation. Not even sure I could tell you why, but somehow it just appealed to me. I even did quite well with it in games. I also tried Scarlet Epicureans, but they never did as well for me, and I could rarely find something useful for the Cronos to do. Shame really, as they probably have my favourite Warlord trait (albeit one I never once managed to use).

- Grotesquerie. I suppose I should list this one as I've used it a lot, but I'm not actually too keen on it. At the points I play at, 2 units of Grotesques (plus the mandatory Haemonculus) is a big chunk of points. I always wished there was a way to get just 1 Coven Grotesque squad. Also, everyone else talks about grotesques as these unstoppable murder-machines that plough through entire enemy armies. I seem to have almost the opposite experience - my grotesques seem to die to anything that looks at them funny, and their rampage through an enemy squad is frequently stopped by enemies with armoured belt-buckles. Neutral

- Dark Artisan. This one can be fun, though it was Grav (not force weapons) that really put me off it. I often made the Haemonculus my Warlord, but in hindsight I think that was a mistake as it made me too cautious with it. If I use it with the aforementioned Corsairs (where I won't be allowed to make it my warlord), then I'll be a lot more aggressive with it and see how that works.
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Klaivex Charondyr
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PostSubject: Re: I fell in love with the coven   Sat Dec 05 2015, 20:43

I hate them with passion. It goes against the DE theme I like (speed and firepower but easily broken) and still feels too mandatory to ignore.
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The Shredder
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PostSubject: Re: I fell in love with the coven   Sat Dec 05 2015, 21:12

@Klaivex Charondyr wrote:
I hate them with passion. It goes against the DE theme I like (speed and firepower but easily broken) and still feels too mandatory to ignore.

Aside from the MCs though, Coven Units are only barely slower than normal DE. They have slightly worse initiative and lack fleet (though the Haemonculus can gain it with Sindriq's Sump and Grots can potentially get it from Grotesquerie). In terms of movement across the board, they're not really any slower than our other units. Our HQs, our Elites, our Troops - they're all stuck moving 6".

Frankly, I think the whole 'DE is a fast army' thing is just a myth.
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Drizzt23
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PostSubject: Re: I fell in love with the coven   Sat Dec 05 2015, 21:17

Thank you guys for all your ideas. I just finished 3 grotesque and a talos to add to my actual cronos ans 5 wracks so i plan to add an Haemonculus. I know i need more to do better with them and i plan to ans with all your advice/opinions i am more excited than ever to try it for myself. Maybe somewhere between now and January i'll have a game with them!

My first formation that i'm going to try would probably be the Dark Artisan i think (the one with an Haemonculus with a cronos and a talos!)
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The Shredder
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PostSubject: Re: I fell in love with the coven   Sat Dec 05 2015, 22:53

In case it's any use, here's a couple of tactics threads about Dark Artisan from a while back:

http://www.thedarkcity.net/t11298-kitting-out-and-deploying-dark-artisan
http://www.thedarkcity.net/t11639-using-a-dark-artisan-warlord-bunker
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Aroban
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PostSubject: Re: I fell in love with the coven   Sat Dec 05 2015, 23:18

"I am in looooove with the co-co"

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Jimsolo
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PostSubject: Re: I fell in love with the coven   Sat Dec 05 2015, 23:56

Grotesquerie, definitely.
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Twicekinless
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PostSubject: Re: I fell in love with the coven   Fri Dec 11 2015, 00:43

So far I've only used the Scalpel Squadron and the Dark Artisan. Of the two, I have to say that I like the Dark Artisan much, much, MUCH more. The Scalpel Squadron's only use I've found is a true null deployment list, but it hurts me to fill them with wracks instead of kabalites. The Dark Artisan on the other hand, is just a monster of a unit, with more staying power than the rest of my army put together! Last game I was playing against Necrons, and my Dark Artisan managed to survive for 3 turns against 10 warriors, 3 wraiths, 5 scarabs, and an Overlord in a Catacomb Command Barge. They died eventually, but anything that holds up that many points for that long is worth it.
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Jimsolo
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PostSubject: Re: I fell in love with the coven   Fri Dec 11 2015, 00:56

I've done well enough with Corpsethief Claws, Dark Artisans, and Grotesqueries that they have made the list of things I've been "politely requested" not to bring anymore.
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Skari
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PostSubject: Re: I fell in love with the coven   Fri Dec 11 2015, 01:42

I fell in love instantly with the Grotesquerie... it makes grotesques an already good unit, really good.

I have used the dark artisan. and I like it as well... but one game does not an oppinion make.

I have also used a scalpel squadron... I love this unit and have used it many a time to play reserve manipulation armies, with an allied autarch... and if you do get first blood with them game winning!

This is all I can comment on as the others have not been used, and I have no frame of reference.
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Twicekinless
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PostSubject: Re: I fell in love with the coven   Fri Dec 11 2015, 14:23

Skari, how do you use the scalpel squadron? It seems like you'd have to deploy them too aggressively to get that fancy first blood reliably.
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dumpeal
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PostSubject: Re: I fell in love with the coven   Fri Dec 11 2015, 15:11

@Twicekinless wrote:
Skari, how do you use the scalpel squadron?  It seems like you'd have to deploy them too aggressively to get that fancy first blood reliably.  

The use for the scalpel squadron is not the bonus points with first blood. Having units arriving T1 allow you to null-deploy.
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Twicekinless
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PostSubject: Re: I fell in love with the coven   Fri Dec 11 2015, 16:50

I understand that. But I'm not sure I can rely on the scalpel squadron to stick around for long enough to make totally sure I won't get tabled. Maybe its just my meta: I play against a lot of Tau, and unfortunately without too much LoS blocking terrain, so I have to deploy them so far back that they feel almost wasted.

That being said, there is something incredibly satisfying about deploying absolutely nothing. I was thinking about using two scalpel squadrons, but that's a lot of points to spend on wracks...
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Klaivex Charondyr
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PostSubject: Re: I fell in love with the coven   Fri Dec 11 2015, 17:26

They dont need to. You want to go second, that way it is next to impossible to get tabled.
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CptMetal
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PostSubject: Re: I fell in love with the coven   Fri Dec 11 2015, 18:08

The end of the game not players turn decides if you get tabled, right?
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Klaivex Charondyr
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PostSubject: Re: I fell in love with the coven   Fri Dec 11 2015, 18:54

Yes it is per game turn. So if you go second Scalpel squadron arrives at the end of the first game turn and even if your opponent kills them in his player turn 2, the rest of your reserves arrive in your player turn 2 so by the end of game turn 2 you still have models on the table.
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Twicekinless
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PostSubject: Re: I fell in love with the coven   Fri Dec 11 2015, 19:47

End of game turn does decide if you get tabled.  But even if you go second, your two venoms and two wrack squads have to survive a turn of the entire enemy shooting at them.  That's what makes me nervous.  I think I may be a little too risk averse for a Dark Eldar player. Rolling Eyes

Oh I see what you're all getting at now. That does make more sense than what I was thinking.
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CptMetal
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PostSubject: Re: I fell in love with the coven   Fri Dec 11 2015, 22:00

The enemy wastes his first round to shoot at nothing and the second only to try and kill your scalpel squadron. On your second turn reserves come in.

And if the scalpel squadron is shot dead and nothing else enters, you get tabled.
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amorrowlyday
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PostSubject: Re: I fell in love with the coven   Sat Dec 12 2015, 07:13

So then make your primary detachment an RRD and fish for Labyrinthine Cunning twice, as well as bringing a CWE CAD for an Autarch. Null deploy and almost everything, and often everyhting, will be coming in turn 2.
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Render Noir
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PostSubject: Re: I fell in love with the coven   Mon Dec 14 2015, 18:58

My latest adventure is Dark Artisan + Corpsethief + Void shield

I have the same issue Shredder has with Grav, so the Void Shield (part of the DE CAD) is there to deter that
It is rather points heavy so sometimes I drop the Corpsethief and run a 3 Talos unit in a HS slot

I would use Scalpel Squadron more but most here play a mx of 3 detachments
Though a unit of Mandrakes is probably just as effective
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