HomeDark Eldar WikiDark Eldar ResourcesNull CityFAQUsergroupsRegisterLog in
Share | 
 

 Let's make a special character

View previous topic View next topic Go down 
Go to page : Previous  1, 2

What type of character should our hero be?
Archon
48%
 48% [ 12 ]
Succubus
4%
 4% [ 1 ]
Haemonculus
20%
 20% [ 5 ]
Other
28%
 28% [ 7 ]
Total Votes : 25
 

AuthorMessage
Jimsolo
Trueborn
avatar

Posts : 2617
Join date : 2013-10-31
Location : Illinois

PostSubject: Re: Let's make a special character   Tue Aug 11 2015, 20:02

The title says Archon Xelian. I'm confused. Is this supposed to be a new character, or is this just giving stats to the guy from the novels?
Back to top Go down
Demantiae
Sybarite
avatar

Posts : 258
Join date : 2015-01-07

PostSubject: Re: Let's make a special character   Tue Aug 11 2015, 21:10

It was originally meant to be a new character but it seems the background for this original character matched the one from the novels so it looks as though she was adopted instead. Makes sense really. I find when original ideas match ideas already detailed out it's best to combine the two and roll with it.

_________________
------------------------------
The Bone Flower
------------------------------
Back to top Go down
Jimsolo
Trueborn
avatar

Posts : 2617
Join date : 2013-10-31
Location : Illinois

PostSubject: Re: Let's make a special character   Tue Aug 11 2015, 21:25

What would people think about coming up with a pen original character? Same stats, even? Xelian from the novels was such a complete moron that I think her ineptitude would keep me from running her on the tabletop, even if her stats were game breakingly OP.
Back to top Go down
Demantiae
Sybarite
avatar

Posts : 258
Join date : 2015-01-07

PostSubject: Re: Let's make a special character   Wed Aug 12 2015, 09:25

This is a homebrew/fanfic type of thing so you can do whatever you like. king Maybe this will be the start of a series of Dark City special characters? I haven't read the novels so can't comment on the characters but I will say that more than a few of GW's official special characters are annoying as hell! I will say though the rules as agreed on (so far) are pretty specific to fighting the Salies so outside of that you probably wouldn't run her.

_________________
------------------------------
The Bone Flower
------------------------------
Back to top Go down
FuelDrop
Kabalite Warrior
avatar

Posts : 207
Join date : 2015-06-21

PostSubject: Re: Let's make a special character   Wed Aug 12 2015, 10:03

Let's ignore the name for the moment, if it's such a big deal it can be changed.

Can I get some feedback about the proposed rules?

_________________
My homebrew codex is really coming along. Check it out here, and feel free to post a comment!
Back to top Go down
Jimsolo
Trueborn
avatar

Posts : 2617
Join date : 2013-10-31
Location : Illinois

PostSubject: Re: Let's make a special character   Wed Aug 12 2015, 23:16

How many points do you propose she should be?

Also, Vulkan.
Back to top Go down
FuelDrop
Kabalite Warrior
avatar

Posts : 207
Join date : 2015-06-21

PostSubject: Re: Let's make a special character   Thu Aug 13 2015, 00:10

Good catch.

I was thinking about 150 points. A little more than an archon with comparable gear, but not much. Also, a nice round number.

Most of the abilities are too specific towards one subsection of one army for there to be a points cost (and against them balances out by giving them an edge against the character in return), and the last one, while good against a wider variety of foes, is still not going to come up too often and so isn't worth many points.

_________________
My homebrew codex is really coming along. Check it out here, and feel free to post a comment!
Back to top Go down
Jimsolo
Trueborn
avatar

Posts : 2617
Join date : 2013-10-31
Location : Illinois

PostSubject: Re: Let's make a special character   Thu Aug 13 2015, 02:08

On one hand, 150 points seems reasonably balanced.  I can't see anything to complain about there.  Even at 145 or 140 I'd think it was reasonable (special rules being hard to assign points values to).

On the other hand, if she were in our codex now, I wouldn't take her.  With no force multipliers and no unique rules/wargear that would have any significant impact, there's nothing beyond fluff to recommend her over a generic HQ.

THAT being said, if I had to take her because of a narrative mission requirement, I wouldn't complain about it.
Back to top Go down
Demantiae
Sybarite
avatar

Posts : 258
Join date : 2015-01-07

PostSubject: Re: Let's make a special character   Thu Aug 13 2015, 13:58

After some thought I'd like to make a counter suggestion for Archon Xelian. I'd also like to say that given how much of this conversation has been steered in the direction of the Salamanders chapter using this character makes perfect sense. Of course other characters can be created with other concepts in mind but this one I think Xelian is the right fit for the shoe.

Archon Xelian:

WS 7 BS 7 S 3 T 3 W 3 I 7 A 4 LD 10 SV 5+

Wargear:

Blast Pistol

Vulkan's Agony (Thunder Hammer):
Range -, Sx2, AP2, Melee, Concussive, *Master Forged.
*A master forged thunder hammer does not suffer the unwieldy rule and can be wielded alongside any other weapon in close combat.

Plasma Grenades
Haywire Grenades
Shadowshield.

May take a Webway Portal (35 points)

Special rules:
Fleet
Power from Pain
Night Vision
Independent Character
Hatred (Salamanders)
Feel No Pain

Fallen House: Once a powerful force in Commorragh politics Xelia's house is little more than a puppet Kabal for the Haemonculi and their machinations. Archon Xelia must be taken as part of a Covenite Coterie Detachment from the Haemonculai Covens book. However she (and any retinue she accompanies) do not take up a slot on the force organization chart. She (and her retinue) also use the PfP table from the DE codex rather than the Covens book.

Bloody History: Archon Xelina has a history with the Salamanders chapter of space marines and their successors stretching back to when Primarch Vulcan was a blacksmith's apprentice. Characters with the Chapter Tactics (Salamanders) special rule MUST accept any challenge she offers, and MUST offer a challenge if in the same combat as her. If multiple characters with this special rule are in the same combat as her then the controlling player may choose who accepts or issues the challenge. In a challenge, such characters gain the Hatred (Archon Xelina) special rule. Any models in Archon Xelia's retinue gain the Hatred (Salamanders) rule.

Scaleskin: Archon Xelina and any Dark Eldar in the same detachment as her gain +1 on feel no pain rolls against Flamer and Melta weapons. If a weapon would ignore FNP normally (due to special rules or instant death), it ignores this rule as well. If Archon Xelina is your army's warlord, all Dark Eldar in the army benefit from this rule.

Loyal to the End: Archon Xelia may include a single unit of Trueborn as a retinue. These warriors are the last of her small but loyal Kabal. Though they're not technically Trueborn (the Haemonculai provide her with replacement vat-grown warriors when they feel she needs to restock) they're so few in number that they're given the better toys as if they were.

Warlord Trait: Soulthirst.


So I figured this character and what remains of her Kabal exist at the mercy of the Haemonculai. Thus they're taken as an addition to a Coven detachment rather than as part of a Kabalite force. Her retinue represents what little of her Kabal is still able to fight on the battlefield. What this does in game terms is allows you to take a Coven list but still squeeze in some Kabal assistance in the form of Blasterborn or Splinterborn, a useful advantage that the Coven list can't replicate. So the character is useful outside of just fighting Salamanders, providing a tactical option no other character can give.

The changes to her wargear and the addition of the retinue give the character a very specific focus that could be useful in a Coven list - anti-TEQ capability. Say you take a 5 man Trueborn retinue, 4 blasters, upgrade to a Dracon with blast pistol. You now have 6 lance shots on TEQ (or armour if you need them) before you charge them. The Dracon can damage he TEQ with his blast pistol whilst Xelia herself is built to destroy them by herself. She's getting 8 attacks on the charge that will rip right through TEQ's. This is something a Coven army will struggle with outside of fielding lots of Taloi. The character is designed to take the elite of a Space Marine army head on in combat and beat them at their own game. Very fluffy and tactically useful IMO. she's still flimsy though. S6 will kill her, if she loses her shield she's dead and she has no real ranged shooting (outside of her Blasterborn). She pretty much has to get into combat and stay there.

I swapped out the Warlord trait because she doesn't strike me as somebody with Labyrinthine Cunning (she wouldn't be such a loser if she was!). She strikes me as bloodthirsty and crazed, clinging to existence through sheer cruelty and horror. And this trait marries well with her close combat anti-TEQ role.

What do you think of this revised version of the character? I personally think it makes for a more rounded and complimentary character that is still pretty useful outside of fighting the lizard marines.

_________________
------------------------------
The Bone Flower
------------------------------
Back to top Go down
FuelDrop
Kabalite Warrior
avatar

Posts : 207
Join date : 2015-06-21

PostSubject: Re: Let's make a special character   Thu Aug 13 2015, 14:18

Warlord trait: Soulthirst?

Really?

Really?

Soulthirst is arguably one of the worst Warlord traits out there, period. I'd have it stricken from the book if I could. Make a custom trait if necessary, but never again mention Soulthirst.

It's an interesting take on the concept though.

There was a practical reason for the pistol-sword loadout on my version too. Ease of conversion.

I'm not sure I like being forced to take her with Coven only, since if we're going to have an Archon special character then it'd be nice if we could take them with, you know, a Kabal.

Maybe we should look at making Xelian a character to take with covens, and a different Archon to have it out for salamanders?

_________________
My homebrew codex is really coming along. Check it out here, and feel free to post a comment!
Back to top Go down
Demantiae
Sybarite
avatar

Posts : 258
Join date : 2015-01-07

PostSubject: Re: Let's make a special character   Thu Aug 13 2015, 15:22

Soulthirst is the only trait that gels well at all with a CC HQ meant to fight Space Marines. Fear is useless, having fearless is useless (if you take the perspective of running it as a Coven list) and I didn't think the +1 WS was appropriate for this character. I figured a character able to pump out 8 attacks vs Termies (who you usually face in squads of 5) will be able to down most if not all of them, and against larger squads the large number of attacks and concussion would make it easier to fight (particularly against other Eldar with their similar initiatives). Sure you could write a new one but I was short on time and just took that straight on of the book Smile

As I've said, you can make as many characters as possible (it'd e nice to have a repository of DE fan characters on this site) I just feel that a character already exists in the universe to cover the original concept of an Archon focused on fighting the Sallies, so may as well use that. I don't know much about the character of Xelian but I would assume logically that the only way she'd survive the events that led to Vect taking power would be to go into hiding and to use the Haemies to keep her alive through the following millenia. It's safe to stay she'd be a tool of their games if that were the case and any kabal she still has (she'd by definition have to have a Kabal being an Archon) would be tiny and pretty insignificant unless backed by a greater power. That's' the reasoning behind tying her to the Coven book, it just happens that the rules I suggested would give the Covens a new edge to help mitigate some of their weakness. A unit of Trueborn would go a long way to adding some needed fire support to that dex.

I'd argue against creating two characters focussing on the Salamanders, I guess it depends on what the community feel is more needed or appropriate really. Regarding the hammer, I think it's kind of poetic for her to use a stolen and tinkered with thunder hammer against the Sallies, it's like poetic justice. And this could well be the reason that Sallie characters hate her and have to take challenges (they want to retrieve this artifact of their chapter). I was looking at basing the weapon off an agonizer or the poison whip that Haemies take, I wanted to try and blend the two but then it made sense to roll with the hammer, both for function and fluff.

These are just my idea's. I'm never going to use such a character myself, I just enjoy rules crafting. Roll with whatever you want Smile

_________________
------------------------------
The Bone Flower
------------------------------
Back to top Go down
 
Let's make a special character
View previous topic View next topic Back to top 
Page 2 of 2Go to page : Previous  1, 2

Permissions in this forum:You cannot reply to topics in this forum
THE DARK CITY :: 

GENERAL DARK ELDAR DISCUSSION

 :: Dark Eldar Discussion
-
Jump to: