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JackKnife01
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PostSubject: Dark Eldar WraithKnight Equvilant?   Wed May 06 2015, 11:42

Seeing as everyone seems to be getting super heavies and creatures all carrying D weapons. That makes me ask the question, do you think we will see one? If not do you think we might see more things being able to take void lances to combat this growing threat?

I would love to see Ravager's with Void Lances. That would be a site.

Basically, do you think we will get something to combat D weapons or be left to dry?
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Count Adhemar
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PostSubject: Re: Dark Eldar WraithKnight Equvilant?   Wed May 06 2015, 11:48

@JackKnife01 wrote:
Basically, do you think we will get something to combat D weapons or be left to dry?

We're Dark Eldar. It'll be option B Sad

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The_Burning_Eye
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PostSubject: Re: Dark Eldar WraithKnight Equvilant?   Wed May 06 2015, 11:53

Much as I would love to see it I think I'm in agreement with the Count.

though D lances on the voidraven might make it worth the points...

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Deamon
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PostSubject: Re: Dark Eldar WraithKnight Equvilant?   Wed May 06 2015, 12:08

Everyone got a LoW (even if it's just a character). We didn't get one, we even lost half our special characters... I don't think GW is planning to give us one, they are probably thinking : If they want one, they can always ally Eldars.
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JackKnife01
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PostSubject: Re: Dark Eldar WraithKnight Equvilant?   Wed May 06 2015, 12:10

I fear they may wipe us out completely. That is why they are, from the looks of it, killing off our characters....perhaps they will replace us with Harlequins.
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The_Burning_Eye
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PostSubject: Re: Dark Eldar WraithKnight Equvilant?   Wed May 06 2015, 13:11

@JackKnife01 wrote:
I fear they may wipe us out completely. That is why they are, from the looks of it, killing off our characters....perhaps they will replace us with Harlequins.

Hardly. they took out the characters that either didn't have a model, or had such an ancient model it didn't do the fluff justice. They also wouldn't have made wracks into a plastic kit if they were planning on killing off the faction any time soon.

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Squidmaster
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PostSubject: Re: Dark Eldar WraithKnight Equvilant?   Wed May 06 2015, 13:31

Personally, looking at the latest rumours, etc, I think we will get out Wraithknight, and it'll be the Dias of Destruction/Vect.
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CptMetal
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PostSubject: Re: Dark Eldar WraithKnight Equvilant?   Wed May 06 2015, 14:00

We will get a better flyer or some kind of monstrous Flesh creature. But that will take some time.

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PostSubject: Re: Dark Eldar WraithKnight Equvilant?   Wed May 06 2015, 14:32

We don't really need a big kit. Rules tweaking to the voidraven would be enough. Void Mine large blast vortex bombing run. Dark scythes stock as is. Upgrade to void lances at D.
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The_Burning_Eye
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PostSubject: Re: Dark Eldar WraithKnight Equvilant?   Wed May 06 2015, 16:34

@Tittliewinks22 wrote:
We don't really need a big kit. Rules tweaking to the voidraven would be enough.  Void Mine large blast vortex bombing run. Dark scythes stock as is. Upgrade to void lances at D.

^This.

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Klaivex Charondyr
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PostSubject: Re: Dark Eldar WraithKnight Equvilant?   Wed May 06 2015, 17:57

Quote :
or had such an ancient model it didn't do the fluff justice.

Like... erm... Drazahr?

There are quite a few things that could fix DE.
Make Splinter Weapons S4 and poison (it is ranged so we do not get to reroll but do not get punished if we fight T3) with lethal dose at a wound roll of 6.
Venoms can transport 6 models.
Raiders transport 12 models.
Trueborn BS5, Bloodbrides WS5
Wyches get Acrobatics and the 4++ works in the entire assault phase.
Wych weapons fixed, up to 4 in a squad of Bloodbrides
Darklances are Salvo 2/1 36"
Power from pain changed to 1-> nothing 2 -> +1 FnP (6+ if no FnP) 3 -> +2 FnP (5+ if no FnP)
Incubi base S4
Hellions move 18", get +1A and gain 4+ cover if they moved
Archon gets reserve manipulation and automatic nightfight
Succubus gets disarm and a 3++ in challenges
Haemonculus in 2 variations again, hand out buffs to coven units
Mandrakes may deepstrike and go into active reserve again
Liquifier -> Poison
Shredder -> S6 Monofile, 24"
Soulfright -> works against any model and is an addition to a weapon effect (like soulblaze)
Talos and cronos cheaper
Ravager can be taken in squads of 3, if they do so they can combine their lances for 1 D shot per Ravager
Voidraven AV11 again, D-1 weapons
complete rework for SCs, add in more SC
Agonizer and power weapons cheaper



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Sensei
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PostSubject: Re: Dark Eldar WraithKnight Equvilant?   Wed May 06 2015, 20:01

Honestly...I don't want an equivalent.

40k is becoming a matter of who shoots first and erases half the other players army turn one. That's no fun. All these super heavies and strength D have no place in regular 40k and should be left to apocalypse. I want my games to be interesting and when games boil down to two massive models duking it out it Is boring.

I didn't invest in my models to play an expensive game of rockem sockem robots....
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Klaivex Charondyr
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PostSubject: Re: Dark Eldar WraithKnight Equvilant?   Wed May 06 2015, 20:25

Quote :
40k is becoming a matter of who shoots first and erases half the other players army turn one.

That is what it always has been since 2nd edition. To be fair, 5th made first steps to move away from that and now in 7th (while turn 1 is still powerful) it is not as bad as it was to go 2nd.
Whats happening atm is an arms race again which will probably lead to the use of less powerful but more numberous units (single shot D weapons are pretty bad if fired at a unit of space marines). It is ok if people are afraid to bring single power units as it is a "risk vs reward" decision unlike before where it was just rewarding with less risks involved than brining any other unit.
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Jimsolo
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PostSubject: Re: Dark Eldar WraithKnight Equvilant?   Wed May 06 2015, 20:34

We will get D strength gargantuan creatures once everyone else has gotten something better.
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CptMetal
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PostSubject: Re: Dark Eldar WraithKnight Equvilant?   Wed May 06 2015, 20:53

You're wish listing Klaivex. Two shot Salvo lances? 18 inch movement? What do you want? The craft world treatment? I don't want that.
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Klaivex Charondyr
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PostSubject: Re: Dark Eldar WraithKnight Equvilant?   Wed May 06 2015, 21:40

@CptMetal wrote:
You're wish listing Klaivex. Two shot Salvo lances? 18 inch movement? What do you want? The craft world treatment? I don't want that.

Actually yes.
Because at the moment there is no point in even trying to play vs Eldar.
I made 6 games this weekend with my Eldar vs my Dark Eldar (a friend of mine played my dark eldar. He is a pretty good player, games tend to be close. He also plays a lot of Eldar.)
The first 2 games were so extremely one sided that we decided to add insult to injury.
I gave him 250 points extra and allowed him to go through my list and try to counter it as hard as possible.
Failed both times, still very one sided.
Last two games were batshit crazy. He got +250 points and I randomized my Eldar army. We basically rolled a D3 for the Host, then a D8 for the various Detachments/Formations and another die for the specific units. Rince and repeat till all points were spent.
Still no win for him. And I really don't think it would be different if it was the other way round.
If both players are equally skilled, Eldar vs DE is not winnable at the moment. I would even argue that the Eldar player can frak up a lot and still come out on top.
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Unholyllama
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PostSubject: Re: Dark Eldar WraithKnight Equvilant?   Wed May 06 2015, 22:30

Compared to CWE, our D-weapon will probably be Disappointment.

Cynical joking aside, I don't know that we need specific D-weapon Super-heavy/Gargantuan Creature kits. I'm not a fan of those outside of true apoc games though so I'm a bit bias.

That all said - I would be curious to see if they brought back Vect and the Dias of Destruction - especially if they make the DoD a Superheavy. It doesn't make sense given it's old rules but would be interesting if it was upgraded to be more of a skimming fortress and not just a command platform.
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Rokuro
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PostSubject: Re: Dark Eldar WraithKnight Equvilant?   Thu May 07 2015, 01:22

Honestly, the only thing in our arsenal I could see becomming a D-weapon is the Void Mine.
Or maybe a new one-use-only artifact... with a 5'' template and 8'' range. Rolling Eyes

As for the Wraith Knight equivalent: Just no. Not going to happen. Ever.
Maybe one day there will be a giant Talos or something, but it definitely won't be as good as the Wraith Knight, let alone stand a chance against it. And it would probably still cost more points, because GW logic.

The only other super heavy thing I could see Dark Eldar getting is a transport with capacity 20, a Void Lance and AV 12/12/10, at best.
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Jimsolo
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PostSubject: Re: Dark Eldar WraithKnight Equvilant?   Thu May 07 2015, 01:37

Maybe some kind of hellacious uber-grotesque?
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JackKnife01
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PostSubject: Re: Dark Eldar WraithKnight Equvilant?   Thu May 07 2015, 03:21

Guys...Guys....maybe a Talos....Inside....get this....A Talos. We can call it.....A DreadTalos. Or Super Talos for short. Better yet! We can have that giant creature from Cloverfield. Just more...Dark Eldary....Give it a whip, some spikes. a hot-topic discount card and BAM! Dark Eldar Wraithknight equivalent.

In all seriousness, would like to see like a suncannon, that is for dark elder. Maybe a Shadowcannon?

Something that gives us a D weapon or at least spam some Void Lances. I am sorry, but one unit in the entire codex gets basically a Lascannon Lance. We have 3 units that can take a Melta Lance. I am not saying I want Raiders riding around with Void Lances. Not saying give infantry them. No, just our Heavy Support. They are there to bring something more than they rest. Heavy Support is suppose to be for the Big Guns.

Ravager with Options for: 3 Diss Cannons/3 Dark Lances/3 Void Lances, or and combination of them. New Heavy Support, a 12/12/10 Raider that supports one GIANT CANNON LANCE. The Marauder, supporting a Shadow Cannon, one massive cannon lance. Str D. Can be changed out to come with Void Scythe Cannon or Executioner Haywire Cannon.

I mean something new. Even when we got new models, we kept all the old toys. Didn't get anything new but our flyers, which don't even have vector dance. I know Ork players who complain about us not have Vector Dance on the Fighter! I just want something that can help us stay in the game and gives us a higher chance of winning. Not asking to be handed the game. Just something equal. Not asking for 5 units with D weapons. I would be completely fine, if we never got a single flipping one, as long as we got to use more Void Lances. As long as we got some other items. A better poison weapon that hurts things with higher toughness more. Like a special poison that wounds bigger models. Something like T3 and under on 5s, T5-T7, 4s, T-8 to T10 3s. Reason, this poison was designed to combine with the blood to make it more toxic. The more the blood, the worse the poison.

I am sorry for the rant/wish listing. Just I really like Dark Eldar and how they work and play, and I knew we were handicapped coming in. I just dislike that we keep getting a bigger and bigger handicap. I mean I have been told that Dark Eldar Armies suck because they have open topped vehicles, by a Grey Knight player. Yea he won the tournament that was put out to bring fun lists and not competitive because this was for new players. So what does this bring, Drop Pod Melta/flamers Blood Angels and Grey Knights.

Against guys who were just getting in, I had been in but I brought a fun list. I was helping them out, he was cutting them in their knees.

I just tired of seeing a fun Army, get utterly laughed out of a Tournament because everyone else sees us as underrated, a fluff-fun army. Not a threat. To be fair though, I enjoy drinking the tears of people who tell me that once they see me in action.

/end rant, Sorry.
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CurstAlchemist
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PostSubject: Re: Dark Eldar WraithKnight Equvilant?   Thu May 07 2015, 04:13

How about a single target weapon/atifact that can immobilize Super Heavies. Maybe make it a one time use item that does no damage but makes it so it can't move or attack for a turn or two. We are pirates and slavers who love our trophies and somthing like this would work fluff wise... I'll just see myself out now...


Last edited by CurstAlchemist on Thu May 07 2015, 04:37; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : Noticed grammar errors.)
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JackKnife01
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PostSubject: Re: Dark Eldar WraithKnight Equvilant?   Thu May 07 2015, 04:18

We have Reapers.
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CurstAlchemist
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PostSubject: Re: Dark Eldar WraithKnight Equvilant?   Thu May 07 2015, 04:32

Sorry I'm not familar with the forgeworld models and rules, I knew I should have kept my mouth shut while the adults were talking.


Last edited by CurstAlchemist on Thu May 07 2015, 04:36; edited 1 time in total
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JackKnife01
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PostSubject: Re: Dark Eldar WraithKnight Equvilant?   Thu May 07 2015, 04:35

No no, I encourage you putting in your opinion, and while we have nothing that does what you state. We do have Reapers which can do D3 Haywire hits a turn at 36" range.
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CptMetal
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PostSubject: Re: Dark Eldar WraithKnight Equvilant?   Thu May 07 2015, 05:50

What is a reaper?

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