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 The Pragmatic Realspace Raider: Disembark Blocking with Reavers

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Mushkilla
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PostSubject: The Pragmatic Realspace Raider: Disembark Blocking with Reavers   Sun Feb 08 2015, 18:27

The Pragmatic Realspace Raider: Disembark Blocking with Reavers

These guides aim to give bitesize advice on the benefits of being pragmatic when playing 40k. They do not intend to delve into mathematical analysis of whether or not the units used in the example are optimal or cost effective, nor do they intend to cover load outs or configurations. Those will be left for other discussions. It is also worth noting that the examples in these guides are simplified for clarity, of course in practice there will be more units involved.

This article aims to illustrate how to use reavers to control how your opponent disembarks from wrecked vehicles. A disembarking model’s base cannot be placed within 1" of an enemy model. We can leverage this to control which access points our opponent can use to disembark.

Example 1:



In this example a small squad of reavers turbo boosts to block the right access point of the land raider crusader. The haywire scourge fire at the land raider wrecking it. The crusader squad inside can’t disembark from the access point blocked by the reavers (which prevents them from disembarking out of line of sight behind the land raider). The positioning of the reavers means the crusader squad has to disembark from the two other access point which leaves them vulnerable to a charge by the incubi.

Example 2:



In this example a small squad of reavers turbo boosts to block the rear access point of the chimera. The haywire scourge fire at the chimera wrecking it. The veteran squad inside can’t disembark from the rear access point of the chimera, forcing them to emergency disembark (meaning they can be placed anywhere in contact with the hull). The positioning of the reavers means they cannot be placed behind the chimera (out of line of sight), as a result the two venoms can shoot at them unimpeded.

Example 3:

In this example two small squads of reavers turbo boost to surround the rhino, leaving a small gap at the front so that they do not give it a cover save against the scourges shooting. The haywire scourge fire at the rhino wrecking it. As the tactical marines cannot be place touching the hull of the rhino without being within 1” of enemy model they cannot disembark and therefore the entire tactical squad is destroyed.



In conclusion, using reavers to block the access points of transports that you are planning on wrecking allows you to control where your opponent will be able to place the disembarking models. This can ensure that the disembarking models are left exposed to shooting and assault by the rest of your forces.

Hope you enjoyed this guide! Razz

For more guides checkout #ThePragmaticRealspaceRaider

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fredpower
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PostSubject: Re: The Pragmatic Realspace Raider: Disembark Blocking with Reavers   Sun Feb 08 2015, 19:01

very nice point. and you can do the last one when assault too =)
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PostSubject: Re: The Pragmatic Realspace Raider: Disembark Blocking with Reavers   Sun Feb 08 2015, 19:24

As soon as I saw the title, I immediately thought about example 3, and wonder if this is going to be our ideal method for killing Necron troops giving how much more resilient they are now. Of course, surrounding a Ghostark will require Reaver units larger than 6.

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PostSubject: Re: The Pragmatic Realspace Raider: Disembark Blocking with Reavers   Sun Feb 08 2015, 19:43

@Erebus wrote:
As soon as I saw the title, I immediately thought about example 3, and wonder if this is going to be our ideal method for killing Necron troops giving how much more resilient they are now. Of course, surrounding a Ghostark will require Reaver units larger than 6.

You also need a reliable way to wreck it (it has 4 hull points if I recall correctly and is open topped so could explode). Pulling that manoeuvre off on a ghost ark would be a real challenge. Also in my experience necron players tend to run their warriors outside the ghost ark as a screen/buffer rather than embarked inside.

Example 3 I put in for completeness. I find it's the least practical of the examples as it requires a lot of reavers to pull off effectively. It can also backfire massively if you fail to wreck the transport. That being said I felt it was worth including in the guide as it can be very effective when the right circumstances arise. Razz

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PostSubject: Re: The Pragmatic Realspace Raider: Disembark Blocking with Reavers   Sun Feb 08 2015, 20:44

@Mushkilla wrote:
Pulling that manoeuvre off on a ghost ark would be a real challenge.


Seriously, though, I'm finding that any of the tradition methods, while easier to pull off, are equally unlikely to be successful with their boost to survivability. Especially when one's rolls are bad as mine.

@Mushkilla wrote:

Also in my experience necron players tend to run their warriors outside the ghost ark as a screen/buffer rather than embarked inside.
For a moment, I was wondering why this was given they don't block line of sight and the cover save for intervening units is less than jinking, then I realised that last game we played jink wrong, using 6th ed rules. Man, I hate that change. I expect my Necron opponent will start doing that when I remind him of the change.

@Mushkilla wrote:

I find it's the least practical of the examples as it requires a lot of reavers to pull off effectively. It can also backfire massively if you fail to wreck the transport.
Sure. Though at this point, I'm looking for any possible trick to use against Necrons.

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PostSubject: Re: The Pragmatic Realspace Raider: Disembark Blocking with Reavers   Sun Feb 08 2015, 22:12

Thanks Mush, never really thought about, about forcing to embark in an exposed way, but should have.

Quote :
Example 3 I put in for completeness. I find it's the least practical of the examples as it requires a lot of reavers to pull off effectively. It can also backfire massively if you fail to wreck the transport. That being said I felt it was worth including in the guide as it can be very effective when the right circumstances arise. Razz

Yeah, i agree. Saw this tactics waaaay before on a blog of guy name Fritz40k, he was doing it with Vypers and Jetbikes. Immediately i liked it.

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PostSubject: Re: The Pragmatic Realspace Raider: Disembark Blocking with Reavers   Sun Feb 08 2015, 22:29

@Mushkilla wrote:
You also need a reliable way to wreck it (it has 4 hull points if I recall correctly and is open topped so could explode).
The open-topped part can be somewhat dodged by using Haywire, though. Glancing hits won't explode anything.
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PostSubject: Re: The Pragmatic Realspace Raider: Disembark Blocking with Reavers   Mon Feb 09 2015, 03:22

So... I have run into this a lot in two different gaming areas and have found most of the people in the areas play very loose with the disembarking and getting killed and or exposed location due to disembark. Have others run into a similar approach? It seems clear in the rules, bit this is the one area I have seen people wholesale ignore or fudge.
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PostSubject: Re: The Pragmatic Realspace Raider: Disembark Blocking with Reavers   Mon Feb 09 2015, 11:05

Blocking the access points is tougher against some of the vehicles with numerous hatches, but Wave Serpents only have one on the back. Easy pickings to wipe out a unit of firedragons or dire avengers with haywire scourges in this way.
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PostSubject: Re: The Pragmatic Realspace Raider: Disembark Blocking with Reavers   Mon Feb 09 2015, 11:07

In the few times it's come up in my experience it has been argued that u can place them on the rhinos roof being part of the hull, any that cannot be placed are removed. This was some time ago though, it's a cheesy ambiguous rule in my opinion and I wouldnt care to argue it much for the sake of fun
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PostSubject: Re: The Pragmatic Realspace Raider: Disembark Blocking with Reavers   Mon Feb 09 2015, 13:16

Love it, really nice guide as always. But this one is my favorite so far, thanks!!

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PostSubject: Re: The Pragmatic Realspace Raider: Disembark Blocking with Reavers   Mon Feb 09 2015, 13:33

@theredone wrote:
In the few times it's come up in my experience it has been argued that u can place them on the rhinos roof being part of the hull, any that cannot be placed are removed. This was some time ago though, it's a cheesy ambiguous rule in my opinion and I wouldnt care to argue it much for the sake of fun

You cannot place models on top of a vehicle. The vehicle only becomes a Wreck after the passengers disembark (see EFFECT OF DAMAGE ON PASSENGERS).

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PostSubject: Re: The Pragmatic Realspace Raider: Disembark Blocking with Reavers   Mon Feb 09 2015, 13:38

@Myrvn wrote:
So... I have run into this a lot in two different gaming areas and have found most of the people in the areas play very loose with the disembarking and getting killed and or exposed location due to disembark. Have others run into a similar approach? It seems clear in the rules, bit this is the one area I have seen people wholesale ignore or fudge.

I haven't really come across that, the rules are pretty clear on the matter so there is no real excuse for sloppy play.

@lessthanjeff wrote:
Blocking the access points is tougher against some of the vehicles with numerous hatches, but Wave Serpents only have one on the back.  Easy pickings to wipe out a unit of firedragons or dire avengers with haywire scourges in this way.

Just blocking the rear access point on the Wave Serpent won't destroy the passengers when the serpent is wrecked as they can still emergency disembark from any part of the hull. To destroy the passengers of any transport when wrecked you need to have a complete surround of the vehicle.

@Aroban wrote:
Love it, really nice guide as always. But this one is my favorite so far, thanks!!

Thanks, glad you liked it! Very Happy

@Count Adhemar wrote:
@theredone wrote:
In the few times it's come up in my experience it has been argued that u can place them on the rhinos roof being part of the hull, any that cannot be placed are removed. This was some time ago though, it's a cheesy ambiguous rule in my opinion and I wouldnt care to argue it much for the sake of fun

You cannot place models on top of a vehicle. The vehicle only becomes a Wreck after the passengers disembark (see EFFECT OF DAMAGE ON PASSENGERS).

What Count said. There's nothing ambiguous about it.

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PostSubject: Re: The Pragmatic Realspace Raider: Disembark Blocking with Reavers   Mon Feb 09 2015, 21:44

Well damn! I have misled some people. I didn't read the emergency disembarking rules carefully enough. Where the damage results for wrecked say they "disembark in the usual manner save that they must end their move wholly within 3 inches" I always took that as normal disembarking from access points. Thanks for the correction!
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PostSubject: Re: The Pragmatic Realspace Raider: Disembark Blocking with Reavers   Wed Feb 11 2015, 19:51

just note that if a unit (that isn't fearless) is forced to emergency disembark, they are immediately pinned in their next turn.  This makes them vulnerable to assaults and effectively takes the momentum away from squads like fire-dragons & IG veterans
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PostSubject: Re: The Pragmatic Realspace Raider: Disembark Blocking with Reavers   Wed Feb 11 2015, 21:38

@clever handle wrote:
just note that if a unit (that isn't fearless) is forced to emergency disembark, they are immediately pinned in their next turn.

Not quite. The rules says:

Quote :
The unit cannot then perform any voluntary actions for the rest of the turn.

As this will often (not always) occur in the enemies turn the unit would be able to act normally on their own turn.

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PostSubject: Re: The Pragmatic Realspace Raider: Disembark Blocking with Reavers   Sun Feb 15 2015, 10:21

@Count Adhemar wrote:
@clever handle wrote:
just note that if a unit (that isn't fearless) is forced to emergency disembark, they are immediately pinned in their next turn.

Not quite. The rules says:

Quote :
The unit cannot then perform any voluntary actions for the rest of the turn.

As this will often (not always) occur in the enemies turn the unit would be able to act normally on their own turn.

Yeah shame it doesn't just make the disembarking unit pinned, that would open up a whole new world of possibilities. Very Happy

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PostSubject: Re: The Pragmatic Realspace Raider: Disembark Blocking with Reavers   Mon Jul 13 2015, 07:52

I very much like example 3. My list includes 3 x 9 reavers so I presume that is possible and even something to play for.
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PostSubject: Re: The Pragmatic Realspace Raider: Disembark Blocking with Reavers   Mon Jul 13 2015, 16:43

That's why I said you want to break them down to three 6's and a 9. Your going to have a hell of a time maintaining unit coherency all around a rhino, and You won't be able to make the cover-less shots if you try to do it with a single large 9 man squad since you'd have to either break unit consistency or shot across your own unit providing the rhino with cover.
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PostSubject: Re: The Pragmatic Realspace Raider: Disembark Blocking with Reavers   Mon Jul 13 2015, 23:07

Thanks mush for another great tactica. I've used these and had them used on me as well. Each valid tactics IMO especially since the drawbacks are real.
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PostSubject: Re: The Pragmatic Realspace Raider: Disembark Blocking with Reavers   Mon Oct 26 2015, 08:23

I just found an interesting tidbit regarding emergency disembarking. I always overlooked the "The unit cannot then perform any voluntary actions for the rest of the turn." rule as pointless as it only lasts until the end of your turn, and doesn't affect your opponents next turn.

However, it would be my understanding that it would prevent a unit that emergency disembarked from firing overwatch? Thoughts?

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PostSubject: Re: The Pragmatic Realspace Raider: Disembark Blocking with Reavers   Mon Oct 26 2015, 08:46

Nice find! Finally some disadvantage for emergy disembark.

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PostSubject: Re: The Pragmatic Realspace Raider: Disembark Blocking with Reavers   Mon Oct 26 2015, 09:29

Good catch! I'll try to remember that.

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PostSubject: Re: The Pragmatic Realspace Raider: Disembark Blocking with Reavers   Mon Nov 02 2015, 20:54

Nice! Presumably also can't go to ground against the next unit's shooting.

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PostSubject: Re: The Pragmatic Realspace Raider: Disembark Blocking with Reavers   Mon Nov 02 2015, 22:34

@thesaltedwound wrote:
Nice! Presumably also can't go to ground against the next unit's shooting.

Wow that's another nice catch.

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