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Sky Serpent
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PostSubject: Are you actually happy that we have an almost entire range?   Fri Aug 26 2011, 19:42

I was thinking earlier about how we have an almost entire range of miniatures released. We all know there was a 6 year wait* for a new codex and range and most feel it was worth the wait but let's look at the bigger picture.

We have a great codex with awesome background and a competitive list that won't need revising until at least 7th edition, unless as anticipated, 6th edition will last for a lot longer than 4 years. It's a list with a lot of scope for different armies and themes, competition in a lot of the force organisation chart and only a few bad choices (which I still think the right person could make them work).

Let's face it, the range wasn't great when first released and the codex was done at a time when GW decided releasing a pamphlet was a good idea. You only have to look to the Guardians that were released a year later to wonder what Jes would have done with them. Did the range need a complete overhaul? Of course. Was the wait worth it. Of course.

They couldn't have simply left us with just the first wave for two years (I can feel the Nids players looking at me with scorn) and perhaps this is where the problem lies. We now have almost everything that we need. The Voidraven is on the horizon, Trueborn/Blood Bride can be easily made from the basic kits and that simply leaves us with half of the special characters and some weapons and vehicle upgrades that Forge World will no doubt mop up.

Long story short, we won't be getting excited about a splash of releases for a long, long time. I doubt GW will forget about them and we will have FW releases to look forward to my enjoy seeing occasional releases trickle out. We should all be happy that we have such a great codex and fantastic range, I'll certainly miss having no releases for the next decade.

*The codex was released almost a year ago, did you start waiting for the next codex there and then? You should only start waiting for a new codex if your list becomes unplayable and unsupported.

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PostSubject: Re: Are you actually happy that we have an almost entire range?   Fri Aug 26 2011, 19:55

I think this *may* be the start of a new roll out process for GW: no more relases of codex until 90%+ of the range is completed (and many special characters nowadays are just premade slots for people to use as their own characters) so you may not see releases of many models in that department.

We'll know in the next codex or two if this keeps up.

It is weird to think that Dark Eldar will again be one of the longest wait codex's to be redone (midway through 7th at earliest)... so probably another 6 year wait!

I'm not 'entirely' sure GW will release a pure voidraven kit, I get the feeling it will be a dual purpose Eldar.Dark Eldar kit, as, unfortunately Eldar/Dark Eldar are one of the lower-mid range sellers.
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PostSubject: Re: Are you actually happy that we have an almost entire range?   Fri Aug 26 2011, 20:06

I would expect Necrons and then Sisters to both get the same treatment as the Dark Eldar did. I know my post seems negative in some respects but we are lucky to have such a fantastic range, all pretty much released just under a year.

The Voidraven will be a pure DE kit and is 99% confirmed.

Do we see a special character or two come out with the Voidraven? Would we see a Dais arrive with Vect? Surely Vect will arrive at some point, every other Codex (correct me if I am wrong) has had their head honcho released straight away, I'm just not convinced the Dais would sell well. An upgrade sprue for the Trueborn wouldn't be viable in my eyes.

Would you like some Collectors models? A pain token kit would sell like hot cakes. Could we see a WD release in two years time to freshen things up? I'd welcome it.

As far as sales go, the DE advance orders outsold the Blood Angels and Space Wolves combined, and more.

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PostSubject: Re: Are you actually happy that we have an almost entire range?   Fri Aug 26 2011, 20:14

The advence orders outsold, and subsequent sales are good, but both darka nd light eldar are lower-mid rung sales wise (compared to space marines, chaos, imperial guard and orks).

I'm not sure about the voidraven... I reckon it will be dual purpose, but we shall see!

They already have a model of vect, and your right I don't see a new dais selling well.

I reckon they will release a new vect (maybe) as a finecast GW, but that forge world will release and upgrade kit for the dais.
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PostSubject: Re: Are you actually happy that we have an almost entire range?   Fri Aug 26 2011, 20:17

I love the idea...

There are so many fantastic ideas in the codex that it's great to see the designers take on what they should be...

I remember (puts on slippers, grabs pipe, and strokes beard in rocking chair) when the Spawn for WoC in WFB were able to be God specific. I made what I thought was an ace conversion, only to be shot down in flames as it wasn't anything like what had been intended (apparantly)

Some may decry the lack of conversion opportunites, but personally I welcome the opportunity to have to be more subtle in my modelling...

Plus, the range is not only 90% complete, it's 100% awesome...

As for the Voidraven... I've heard a little squeak of it not being purely DE...
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PostSubject: Re: Are you actually happy that we have an almost entire range?   Fri Aug 26 2011, 20:20

I'm kinda optimistic about this codex. Unlike Orks it doesn't have too much "little annoying things"* and probably would be more "edition proof" due to nearly all "army wide rules" beeing either in codex or vital part of ruleset.

I don't see how GW would change it politics tho.
Orks were good at end of 4th ed - they got starter + kits. Later... ngggh.
Marines are good - full range.
Nids were poop - got only collector minis (mostly Trygon) + massive repack + "we need to dump Carnifex boxes, let's give them Tervigons and T-fexes without models, lulz".
IG got new tanks and "chimera spam" - massive repack + new good tanks
GK are "good" (I smell nerf in next edition), they got minis of good things.
Sisters? Reverse - there would be no new models in near future so they got "Flier Codex". On the other hand if they would put a lot of effort in new range, then they mau have good rules.
Depending on how good/bad Necrons would be You'll see more or less minis.

I still fail to see why GW can't learn that BT/DA flick (upgrade in FAQ to boost Your sales) is good.
You know how many BT armies I saw at tournaments before FAQ?
0
After about 10% of "Marines" were BT.

*
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Last edited by Local_Ork on Sat Aug 27 2011, 10:23; edited 2 times in total
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PostSubject: Re: Are you actually happy that we have an almost entire range?   Fri Aug 26 2011, 20:22

Yeah, echos in the webway about that ;P

The range is awesome, about the only whing I havent wowed over so far is the talos/chronos, but thats only because it doesn't suit my personal tastes (grea model) - Oh and the raider, an improvement on the last one, but I still don't think its sleek enough.

THere's plenty of conversion opportunities for me!

fiding good archon ideas (to break away from the standard model), finding alternative court members to represent those that already exist, wrack/grotesque modeling etc. etc. Very Happy

Oh and the fabness of having harlequins to play around with!
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PostSubject: Re: Are you actually happy that we have an almost entire range?   Fri Aug 26 2011, 21:09

Sky Serpent wrote:
As far as sales go, the DE advance orders outsold the Blood Angels and Space Wolves combined, and more.
Really? How were their overall sales? Is there a site with these sale numbers? I'd love to see a breakdown by range and kits.

Also - DE waited longer than 6 years for a Codex. The pseudo-dex doesn't count. Wink

Oh, and I'm beyond happy - I'm ecstatic.
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PostSubject: Re: Are you actually happy that we have an almost entire range?   Fri Aug 26 2011, 21:44

I don't know about actual sales figures but a lot of 'in the know' guys from Warseer confirmed it, would be hard to cite that statement though.

I know, it was longer than six years, how long did it take for Vect and the Hellions to drop etc? The pseudo-dex was a nice gesture in some respects though, I just hate it when people say they waited for xx years for a new codex when it takes a while before you start pining. Unless you play CSM and nids of course.

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PostSubject: Re: Are you actually happy that we have an almost entire range?   Fri Aug 26 2011, 21:53

If you want to start talking pining for a Dex...did I ever? I actually loved the old Dex, and probably consider it as good (and maybe better) than current Dex. I think new Dex does shooting better and old Dex did assault better. I like new Dex better for games over 1850, definitely. I was pining for new sculpts for forever and a day though.

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PostSubject: Re: Are you actually happy that we have an almost entire range?   Sat Aug 27 2011, 08:46

In terms of our models, I am ecstatic that we essentially have a complete range already, and I am quite sure that the VR and Vect will follow relatively soon. Considering that some of the concept sketches for the Raider are dated 2006, I think we are extremely lucky that so much has been done to get as much of this army out as quickly as they have.

I don't know why they did it, I'm not even close to being convinced that GW has a new release strategy. They have been great on WFB stuff this past year, but for 40K in the past 18 months they have hit a home run with DE and wiffed completely with Sisters and 'Nids. And the Muh-reen releases? Well, you can slap a blonde wig on a Muh-reen and it will sell, so they don't count.

I do think that we have a solid codex that will see us through 6th and probably 7th, maybe with a little complementary tweak when CWE finally gets refreshed and there's some carry over. There are some minor annoyances that could be fixed via WD, but the flexibility and variety in this codex is amazing. You can easily build 3 or 4 completely different armies to keep you happy, and unlike the gawdawful previous range, these new models will stand the test of time on their own very well, and also permit extensive converting.

Now, where the hell are the rest of my new 'Nid units?
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PostSubject: Re: Are you actually happy that we have an almost entire range?   Sat Aug 27 2011, 09:19

I liked old dex and love new one, love models and It will take me lots of time to get bored with my minis so dont mind waiting 6+years for next.
I still wait for more plains and that big slave-bark....

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PostSubject: Re: Are you actually happy that we have an almost entire range?   Sat Aug 27 2011, 09:45

I've actually given this some thought, and its hard to say really. Its great that so much is available, but at the same time its a curse. Why? Well because new releases attract new players, and thats always a good thing for an army. Conversely lack of models for example TWC in the Wolves codex stopped me picking them up.

We may though see a release, or 2, via White Dwarf ala Eldar Prism/Spinner.
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PostSubject: Re: Are you actually happy that we have an almost entire range?   Sat Aug 27 2011, 10:02

I don't mind waiting, since along the way there will be plenty of other things to spark my interest. And hell, GW might even surprise us like when they added that overheating sniper option for Pathfinders. Or something.

PS: here's to (hopefully) an awesome Klaivex sculpt in the works Smile

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PostSubject: Re: Are you actually happy that we have an almost entire range?   Sat Aug 27 2011, 15:42

I'd presume that when the Craftworld codex eventually lands that the Harlequins would get a tweak and perhaps an FAQ placing us on par with a potential new edition.

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PostSubject: Re: Are you actually happy that we have an almost entire range?   Sat Aug 27 2011, 20:50

Well, after the big waves GW seems to be petering out slowly with the few units left without models.

Maybe they just feel bad that the DE have been neglected for so long. Wishful thinking?

The new models seem to be attracting a lot of players now that they seem a more feasible army to play. I agree with darkmark, when I pick up a codex and flip to a super cool unit that makes me want to play that army but then find out I either need a very difficult conversion or there's virtually no model basis to go off at all it's kind of discouraging.

Due to the poor 'Nids model range getting my wife the swarmlord she wanted seemed to either need some serious conversion which both of us would probably be dissatisfied with or four hive tyrant kits. Fortunately we were able to special order a matching set of arms from ebay. Which still brought the total model cost up to about 75$ but that's a lot better than 200$.

All in all I think it's a good thing. If (or when) the DE model range is complete I can see GW maybe making small expansions or a trickle of new units/codex additions here or there. Expansions certainly are where the money's at but I don't necessarily expect them to always do what's smart. The basis for this theory comes from the fact that they've put so much time into the line already! Many people who don't even play Dark Eldar say that they're some of the best out right now. I don't see the model junkies/monkeys up at citadel to finish the line and say "Well that was fun, let's not touch these guys for another twelve years."

Whew. Pardon what turned into kind of a rant. The slave holding up my soapbox died, so that will have to be all from me until I find another one. And add something spikey to said soapbox. Soulbox?

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PostSubject: Re: Are you actually happy that we have an almost entire range?   Sat Aug 27 2011, 21:20

Lurking Evil wrote:
Whew. Pardon what turned into kind of a rant. The slave holding up my soapbox died, so that will have to be all from me until I find another one. And add something spikey to said soapbox. Soulbox?

Why did you abuse a perfectly good soulbox like that? You have slaves (and/or defeated enemies), just stand on a mound made of them!

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PostSubject: Re: Are you actually happy that we have an almost entire range?   Sun Aug 28 2011, 09:32

NO, want klaivex, Voidraven and Characters nownownownow NOW!!!

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PostSubject: Re: Are you actually happy that we have an almost entire range?   Sun Aug 28 2011, 15:51

Sorrowshard wrote:
NO, want klaivex, Voidraven and Characters nownownownow NOW!!!

Concept art for Drazhar's blades were shown at Gamesday Chicago. Wink Which kind of suggests to The Decapitator might be coming to so there is a nightfiend model. Otherwise wasn't malys confirmed as a releases a while back?

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PostSubject: Re: Are you actually happy that we have an almost entire range?   Sun Aug 28 2011, 16:22

Quote :
Concept art for Drazhar's blades
Oh. Pictures?
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PostSubject: Re: Are you actually happy that we have an almost entire range?   Sun Aug 28 2011, 16:36

Jes's sketchbook, no pics allowed. Wink

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PostSubject: Re: Are you actually happy that we have an almost entire range?   Sun Aug 28 2011, 18:01

Sky Serpent wrote:

The Voidraven will be a pure DE kit and is 99% confirmed.
100 % confirmed, and IIRC the "multi range" kit rumor came from a source that spread disinformation about this particular kit (that it was delayed due to problems in the proto).

Sky Serpent wrote:
I'd presume that when the Craftworld codex eventually lands that the Harlequins would get a tweak and perhaps an FAQ placing us on par with a potential new edition.
Or a WD ruleset, since they seem to be trying those out for now. Wouldn't be surprised if there was an HQ character too, but now we've crossed from the "I know" to the "I think" domain. Smile
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PostSubject: Re: Are you actually happy that we have an almost entire range?   Sun Aug 28 2011, 19:39

Yes, pictures ! I think old drazzy is the model I am most excited about, pity he is too crap/expensive to make the table unless I feel like a handicap.

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PostSubject: Re: Are you actually happy that we have an almost entire range?   Sun Aug 28 2011, 22:11

Hurray for potentially new Drazhar model! It will probably end up being a very nice proxy for a Klaivex at the very least.

Oh, and it would be interesting and rather nostalgic to see if they decided to revisit the old Dais of Destruction model. Hopefully it will have hot slaves like the last one did. By the dark gods though if they make it finecast... My wallet weeps in anticipation.

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PostSubject: Re: Are you actually happy that we have an almost entire range?   Sun Aug 28 2011, 23:21

The range is exquisite and complete enough to keep me going until the next run, even if it does take another ten years. I can only hope the Codex remains competitive during the next Edition.

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