HomeDark Eldar WikiDark Eldar ResourcesNull CityFAQUsergroupsRegisterLog in
Share | 
 

 Splintermind Episode 4

Go down 
Go to page : 1, 2  Next
AuthorMessage
Thor665
Archon
avatar

Posts : 5484
Join date : 2011-06-10
Location : Venice, FL

PostSubject: Splintermind Episode 4   Thu Oct 30 2014, 03:30

Episode 4 is now up and live;

Episode 4

Mostly it's a review of Heavy and Elite options, though we do manage to delve deeply into the MAJOR ramifications of the FAQ. Also, ESE tells a story, that starts with a sigh, has a crunch in the middle, and ends with a facepalm. I offer support by repeatedly laughing at him Razz

_________________


The Title Troupe! - Nom fellow posters for custom titles.
Back to top Go down
Grub
Wych
avatar

Posts : 823
Join date : 2011-09-04

PostSubject: Re: Splintermind Episode 4   Thu Oct 30 2014, 09:31

All good again!

You are spot on with the Mandrakes, yes you can argue that they will get a FnP save which does make them pretty durable from shooting but they are still redundant. A polished turd is still a turd, albeit a shadowy turd.

Grots high-fived as they walked past the nerf room. Yup, with that £15.50 ($25 when you convert) price tag hanging off just one of them, I can see what GW have done there, shameless. Everblight Warspears/Rat Ogre Converts every time!

Dark Artisan looks to me as the best formation in the book. Its durable, it will attract attention and divert fire and it will chew through most things. Sounds good to me!

Voidchicken bomber is a lovely model. But it needs a change to its rules and costs (which isn't going to happen) to make it any way viable.

But again, great job, this podcast genuinely improves my work day. Kudos.




_________________
Delicious and Coven-Baked for your Pleasure

A very slow, 30K Salamander Distraction Log: VULKAN LIVES
Back to top Go down
Thor665
Archon
avatar

Posts : 5484
Join date : 2011-06-10
Location : Venice, FL

PostSubject: Re: Splintermind Episode 4   Thu Oct 30 2014, 15:27

Glad to hear you liked it!

_________________


The Title Troupe! - Nom fellow posters for custom titles.
Back to top Go down
Expletive Deleted
Wych
avatar

Posts : 581
Join date : 2013-07-31

PostSubject: Re: Splintermind Episode 4   Thu Oct 30 2014, 17:51

Another good episode guys.

Not much to say about the elite section, everything was pretty much well said and accurate.

The ravager, if it was undercosted, it wasn't by that much. You can get a tri-las predator for 140 points in the CSM codex which has about the same threat bubble and front armor 13. And one of those lascannons is twin-linked. If you want a comparison. You could argue jink gives it a great cover save, but it's also open topped, so any degree of high S shooting can cause it to explode. I'm not as miffed as I initially was, but yeah they're still the best option in the section.

The voidraven actually wasn't that bad in the last codex, I know you didn't like it Thor but I used to run one with two razorwings, and had a lot of success. Losing AV 11 was huge. I'm not a fan of ravagers, because I like a little more variety and they look like raiders. My opponents could rarely tell them apart. And the three gave me moderate AA. Missed opportunity. If the Voidraven has stayed the same I could have seen picking up two and running 4 flyers. That's $160 GW did not get. And yeah the blast weapon is for heavy infantry ESE. You should see what it does to Paladins. I still don't understand why the bomb isn't S10 though. A concentrated black hole does less damage than demolisher cannon's siege shell? scratch

I need to pick up the coven supplement, some of those formations sound pretty interesting.

Don't think I'll be buying 4 talos though. Haha.

_________________
"Excess, yeah that's what we do best."
Back to top Go down
Dragontree
Wych
avatar

Posts : 521
Join date : 2013-11-15
Location : Bristol

PostSubject: Re: Splintermind Episode 4   Thu Oct 30 2014, 18:12

Excellent episode!

Though my heart did sink a little bit until ESE finished with a stick in the eye Razz

You guys definitely seem to play off one another more slickly now, and the pace of the talking and ideas is really really easy to follow.

Look forward to fast attack!

_________________
Ave Dominus Nox - Brothers of Nostramo Night Lords Plog

@The_Burning_Eye wrote:
it's the Starsky and Hutch venom! but I'm kinda ok with that
Back to top Go down
Evil Space Elves
Haemonculus Ancient
avatar

Posts : 3659
Join date : 2011-07-13
Location : Santa Cruz, ca

PostSubject: Re: Splintermind Episode 4   Thu Oct 30 2014, 19:25

@Dragontree wrote:

Though my heart did sink a little bit until ESE finished with a stick in the eye Razz
Gotta finish strong I tell you Twisted Evil

@Dragontree wrote:
You guys definitely seem to play off one another more slickly now, and the pace of the talking and ideas is really really easy to follow.
I really appreciate this feedback. Most podcasts are hosted by buddies that have played together for years. We've never met in person,and had never even had a conversation before we decided to make a podcast in a thread discussed in the admin portion of the site. I assure you that we continue our conversations about all things Dark Eldar even after the recording has stopped. This podcast has really been a blast to record and I'm so grateful that people are enjoying it. Twisted Evil Twisted Evil Twisted Evil

_________________

"Solutions are good, how many dark eldar archons can you find sitting in their throne rooms whining that they used to rule the universe? Exactly."  -The Burning Eye
Splintermind: The Dark Eldar Podcast
My Dark Eldar Project Log
Back to top Go down
Calyptra
Wych
avatar

Posts : 738
Join date : 2013-03-25
Location : Boston

PostSubject: Re: Splintermind Episode 4   Thu Oct 30 2014, 22:07

I'm continuing to enjoy them.

"Better than a stick in the eye" seems like it's becoming a catch phrase. Which is fine, but it does make me worry that your Haemonculi lack imagination.

"Your suffering shall be legendary. Yrighiaz! Bring me my poking stick!"

On the other hand, I suppose you can get inventive with how you define "stick."

"Comfortably paralyzed? Good. I have planted the seed of the Trighaskellian razor tree beneath you. It will grow at a rate of precisely seven inches per day, using your body for support. As its lateral branches pierce your flesh, it will connect to your circulatory system, so that although you will be impaled, very slowly, in a thousand places, you will not die. Instead, you will have a remarkable vantage point from which to appreciate horticulture."

Anyway. I like the podcast.

_________________
Dark Eldar plog: Drug-Crazed Space Elves
Vampire Counts plog: Bat Country
Back to top Go down
Evil Space Elves
Haemonculus Ancient
avatar

Posts : 3659
Join date : 2011-07-13
Location : Santa Cruz, ca

PostSubject: Re: Splintermind Episode 4   Fri Oct 31 2014, 03:03

@Calyptra wrote:
"Better than a stick in the eye" seems like it's becoming a catch phrase. Which is fine, but it does make me worry that your Haemonculi lack imagination.

Oh game on! *goes back to the torture chamber to find something pokier. Razz

_________________

"Solutions are good, how many dark eldar archons can you find sitting in their throne rooms whining that they used to rule the universe? Exactly."  -The Burning Eye
Splintermind: The Dark Eldar Podcast
My Dark Eldar Project Log
Back to top Go down
spellcheck2001
Le Maitre Macabre
avatar

Posts : 1315
Join date : 2013-03-28
Location : La La Land

PostSubject: Re: Splintermind Episode 4   Fri Oct 31 2014, 09:15

Great stuff again guys. I agree with the others above, you both have a nice synergy together and create good banter while at the same time talking intelligently about your subject at hand Smile

Oh and personally I think the ravaged is now over costed. As per the predator example above, most other armies can get a miles better unit for only a little more cost (although we are pretty limited in our anti tank options so the ravager is still a no brainer)

_________________
clown  My DE project log  jocolor :- Harlequin Carnivale - La Danse Macabre

study  My Wargaming blog   cherry  :- Objective Secured
Back to top Go down
http://www.objectivesecured.blogspot.co.uk
Cavalier
Wych
avatar

Posts : 580
Join date : 2013-01-19
Location : North Carolina

PostSubject: Re: Splintermind Episode 4   Fri Oct 31 2014, 11:29

Great episode guys. Feel like this episode had the perfect 50/50 balance of ESE/Thor input on each of the topics. BTW ESE... maybe its cause we're die hard paint addicts but I'm comitted to getting that Void Raven to work on the tabletop! I've got a super nasty list that I think allows the VR to get in there and do its thing.... I'll have a host of bat-reps soon in my project log so hopefully we can prove its worth!

_________________
Checkout my Project- Lions of Asuryan:Eldar Corsairs http://www.thedarkcity.net/t5288-lions-of-asuryan-craftworld-eldar-updates
Back to top Go down
The_Burning_Eye
Trueborn
avatar

Posts : 2501
Join date : 2012-01-16
Location : Rutland - UK

PostSubject: Re: Splintermind Episode 4   Fri Oct 31 2014, 12:01

I listened to the episode last night and really enjoyed it, though I'll admit i think you're selling Mandrake's shooting a little short - that many shots at AP4 is not something we have a lot of access to, they seem designed to annoy Tau and Guard Veterans to me - both of which are T3 so you're looking at about 8 unsaved wounds (not counting cover, which if you're outflanking should be huge anyway) from a full unit. Just as a comparison, that's better shooting results than a gunboat raider at rapid fire range with splinter racks, for 30pts less (I know their target range is narrow, but the baleblast doesn't perform any worse against MEQ than poison until you add in re-rolls to hit either)

That being said, ESE's piling stupid on top of stupid quote was a highlight for me!

Question - are you guys planning on addressing topics of interest on the forum once you've exhausted unit reviews? I think it'd be really interesting to hear the podcast pick up on hot topics...

_________________
Tan? You're joking, I'm a gamer, you're lucky I'm wearing deodorant!

My Blog - The Burning Eye Blog (check it out - comments always welcome)

My Project Log - Visions of the Burning Eye

My Gaming Log - Chronicles of the Burning Eye

My Club - MAD Wargaming

My Fluff - Kabal of the Burning Eye, Cult of the Shadowed Blade and Coven of Distorted Perfection
Back to top Go down
http://theburningeye.blogspot.com
Thor665
Archon
avatar

Posts : 5484
Join date : 2011-06-10
Location : Venice, FL

PostSubject: Re: Splintermind Episode 4   Fri Oct 31 2014, 16:17

@The_Burning_Eye wrote:
Question - are you guys planning on addressing topics of interest on the forum once you've exhausted unit reviews? I think it'd be really interesting to hear the podcast pick up on hot topics...
We have some show ideas already, but suspect we'll end up discussing some things that are topical.
If there's anything you'd like to see us address - you can always drop us an email at advicearchon@gmail.com or post a question to one of the show threads, or drop us a PM. I suspect we'd both welcome show ideas Very Happy

_________________


The Title Troupe! - Nom fellow posters for custom titles.
Back to top Go down
Crazy_Irish
Sybarite


Posts : 487
Join date : 2011-05-28
Location : Huntsville, Al

PostSubject: Re: Splintermind Episode 4   Fri Oct 31 2014, 22:28

Well as always a blast to listen! Just on thing to note. Thor665 sometimes goes low and then high in volume. Next time I hear it I'll write down the time for reference.

On the topic, as usual great thoughts on the unit entry's! But in regards to the mandrakes I'm on TBEs side. I think the improved overall. Starting with BB is pretty huge for them as they can now act the turn that they arrive/are placed. Also loosing the 5++ isn't that bad as it would have mostly been used in CC and that is not what they are meant for, as they do not have any special CC weapons/skills. Keep them in cover and our of harms way (ignoring cover) what should be possible, as with infiltrate you can choose/ improve your matchup.


_________________
...What about a Bastion made out of Guardsmen as some form of sick sarcasm?...Or a Fortress of Redemption made out of Dark Angels - Sky Serpent
Back to top Go down
Evil Space Elves
Haemonculus Ancient
avatar

Posts : 3659
Join date : 2011-07-13
Location : Santa Cruz, ca

PostSubject: Re: Splintermind Episode 4   Sat Nov 01 2014, 00:07

@Crazy_Irish wrote:
On the topic, as usual great thoughts on the unit entry's! But in regards to the mandrakes I'm on TBEs side. I think the improved overall. Starting with BB is pretty huge for them as they can now act the turn that they arrive/are placed. Also loosing the 5++ isn't that bad as it would have mostly been used in CC and that is not what they are meant for, as they do not have any special CC weapons/skills. Keep them in cover and our of harms way (ignoring cover) what should be possible, as with infiltrate you can choose/ improve your matchup.

I think I'm with you on this one, though I have no experience using them with the new codex....because I still can't find them Razz Seriously, I have a painted unit and can't remember where in the hell they are Mad

I think you bring up a good point in that they aren't meant to be used in CC,though their S4 might suggest otherwise. They do get in a bit of a pickle due to the 18" range though where they are vulnerable to getting charged by many units after shooting at them. I could see using them for infiltrating/objective camping shenanigans while picking on weak units that they can win a firefight with for mop up duty.

_________________

"Solutions are good, how many dark eldar archons can you find sitting in their throne rooms whining that they used to rule the universe? Exactly."  -The Burning Eye
Splintermind: The Dark Eldar Podcast
My Dark Eldar Project Log
Back to top Go down
Crazy_Irish
Sybarite


Posts : 487
Join date : 2011-05-28
Location : Huntsville, Al

PostSubject: Re: Splintermind Episode 4   Sat Nov 01 2014, 14:02

As with many DE units mandrakes need support or can only be left in charge of the mopping up, that is true, but adding supporting troops should let them shine glow ;-)

But I see you have the same hobby problems that I have. Had to look all over the place for my WIP coven raider and it nearly made me start tyranids again :-D

_________________
...What about a Bastion made out of Guardsmen as some form of sick sarcasm?...Or a Fortress of Redemption made out of Dark Angels - Sky Serpent
Back to top Go down
Thor665
Archon
avatar

Posts : 5484
Join date : 2011-06-10
Location : Venice, FL

PostSubject: Re: Splintermind Episode 4   Sat Nov 01 2014, 15:22

@Crazy_Irish wrote:
Well as always a blast to listen! Just on thing to note. Thor665 sometimes goes low and then high in volume. Next time I hear it I'll write down the time for reference.
That's actually mostly just me being me - I'm kind of a quiet speaker but when I get excited I get a lot louder. I'm trying to work on that.

@Crazy_Irish wrote:
On the topic, as usual great thoughts on the unit entry's! But in regards to the mandrakes I'm on TBEs side. I think the improved overall. Starting with BB is pretty huge for them as they can now act the turn that they arrive/are placed. Also loosing the 5++ isn't that bad as it would have mostly been used in CC and that is not what they are meant for, as they do not have any special CC weapons/skills. Keep them in cover and our of harms way (ignoring cover) what should be possible, as with infiltrate you can choose/ improve your matchup.
I will agree they improved overall (it would have been hard to get worse)
All I'm saying is that there's pretty minimal need for an elite sniper unit with n 18" range that can't do much of anything in assault.
If they had a 36" range baleblast they would be a fine unit because then they would be a sniper unit (and I still wouldn't use them - but at least couldn't justify calling them bad)
But an 18" range sniper unit that would have trouble if assaulted by basic Guardsmen?
No thanks.

Also, yes, I will agree you can "synergize" and "combo" them to make them better.
You can also do that with other units.
Units that are capable of beating up basic Guardsmen.

_________________


The Title Troupe! - Nom fellow posters for custom titles.
Back to top Go down
Tengu
Wych
avatar

Posts : 532
Join date : 2013-05-02
Location : The Quantum Realm

PostSubject: Re: Splintermind Episode 4   Sat Nov 01 2014, 16:55

They dont like you, ESE, and have hidden.

Mandrakes are like that.
Back to top Go down
Evil Space Elves
Haemonculus Ancient
avatar

Posts : 3659
Join date : 2011-07-13
Location : Santa Cruz, ca

PostSubject: Re: Splintermind Episode 4   Sat Nov 01 2014, 17:41

@Tengu wrote:
They dont like you, ESE, and have hidden.

Mandrakes are like that.

I suppose I'll just probe around in the shadows until there's an icy chill in the air..... Shocked

_________________

"Solutions are good, how many dark eldar archons can you find sitting in their throne rooms whining that they used to rule the universe? Exactly."  -The Burning Eye
Splintermind: The Dark Eldar Podcast
My Dark Eldar Project Log
Back to top Go down
Thor665
Archon
avatar

Posts : 5484
Join date : 2011-06-10
Location : Venice, FL

PostSubject: Re: Splintermind Episode 4   Sat Nov 01 2014, 18:21

Don't probe too hard, they don't have a save against that.

_________________


The Title Troupe! - Nom fellow posters for custom titles.
Back to top Go down
Mngwa
Wych
avatar

Posts : 955
Join date : 2013-01-26
Location : Stadi

PostSubject: Re: Splintermind Episode 4   Sat Nov 01 2014, 18:26

Wracks are now min squad size of 5, which is already making me think should I not field them anymore.

Only 20 points more expensive and a more durable squad, but it's now impossible to field a squad with venom for less than 100 points Sad
We can take a venom on its own though, but it is less versatile. When it blows up, it leaves nothing behind. Can't provide two targets or claim two objectives.
And 5 wracks in a venom also means no IC to escort with them.

I am considering getting them a raider though, so I can field a haemonculi with them. Maybe the ossefactor. They come a little more assaulty, not sure if I want a new unit for it. If I give them a special weapon and make them even more expensive I would certainly not want to keep them backfield for long...


Aaanyway. I do enjoy listening to these. I also may have missed this but how often are you planning on releasing episodes? Seems like once a week for an episode, which seems good for the length they are.
Back to top Go down
Thor665
Archon
avatar

Posts : 5484
Join date : 2011-06-10
Location : Venice, FL

PostSubject: Re: Splintermind Episode 4   Sat Nov 01 2014, 18:29

@Mngwa wrote:
I also may have missed this but how often are you planning on releasing episodes? Seems like once a week for an episode, which seems good for the length they are.
We're doing 1/week for the release month of October.

Moving forward we're shifting to 1/month with the possibility of surprise bonus episodes. But since recording generally requires a few hours of a weekend, plus editing times, it's not something either ESE or I can commit to as a regular weekly thing. Even for this month the whole Episode 3.5 thing grew out of a schedule conflict that prevented doing a recording.

_________________


The Title Troupe! - Nom fellow posters for custom titles.
Back to top Go down
DingK
Kabalite Warrior
avatar

Posts : 236
Join date : 2013-03-31

PostSubject: Re: Splintermind Episode 4   Sun Nov 02 2014, 09:03

In an impromptu 750 game yesterday, I took a Dark Artisan and Scalpel Squadron. Like ESE, I went "full stupid" and upgraded both just to make it to 750 (at the moment, I had no other way of producing a legal list).
While I certainly lacked some bodies and AT against my opponent's Orks, the Dark Artisan formation kicked some serious behind. Three templates wiped out a unit of 15 Gretchin, and after a round of fire from 3 Killa Kans AND a Deff Dread, my Cronos only had a single wound on him. Will definitely field this one again, the jury's still out on the Scalpel Squadron.
Back to top Go down
PartridgeKing
Kabalite Warrior
avatar

Posts : 203
Join date : 2011-11-08

PostSubject: Re: Splintermind Episode 4   Mon Nov 03 2014, 22:24

Just going to go out on a limb here and say that if your next episode ended up being three hours long, I for one would not complain.

I do also wonder if you've yet to start producing an outtakes / bloopers 'reel' yet?
Back to top Go down
jbwms713
Kabalite Warrior


Posts : 116
Join date : 2013-07-13

PostSubject: Re: Splintermind Episode 4   Mon Nov 03 2014, 23:44

Have to jump in and disagree on Mandrakes, with the caveat that I haven't had a chance to whip them out fully yet...

I'm super stoked to try them out. I think they're a great distraction, that can cause some seriously legit damage. I think people focus too much on their mediocre combat (agreed, but it always has been) and not enough on their overall use.

Step one, 18" doesn't matter nearly as much when you can infiltrate, especially if you can do it into the enemy's backfield. 7 of these buggers are under 100 points, and put out enough S4 to threaten even light armor. Sure, a good player knows how to bubblewrap or back up against their board edge enough to avoid this, but if you don't have Mandrakes at all, they don't have to worry about it. Restrict their deployment options from the start.
Step 2. Any cover gives you a 2+ save (barring maybe some tall grass, even then it's a 3+). So in terms of shooting, so much more survivable. And if you die? It was less than 100 points. How much fire can any other 100 point unit take from our book? Maybe 3 Grotesques can absorb similar amounts, but... seriously.
Step 3 - if you're pointing your Wave Serpents and Markerlights at my 100 point unit of Mandrakes, then good day, sir, I call that a win.
Step 4 - while their combat is 'meh', it's just the same as the last book, for a fair bit cheaper. They're really a shooty unit, that can mop up a nearly-dead squad more effectively than most of our other stuff thanks to S4.

PS - Baleblast was AP4 last time around, too.
Back to top Go down
Thor665
Archon
avatar

Posts : 5484
Join date : 2011-06-10
Location : Venice, FL

PostSubject: Re: Splintermind Episode 4   Tue Nov 04 2014, 03:52

@jbwms713 wrote:
Have to jump in and disagree on Mandrakes, with the caveat that I haven't had a chance to whip them out fully yet...

I'm super stoked to try them out.  I think they're a great distraction, that can cause some seriously legit damage.  I think people focus too much on their mediocre combat (agreed, but it always has been) and not enough on their overall use.
I also have issues with their mediocre shooting.

I mean, sure, for less than 100 points you can get 14 S4 shots
For less than that I can get a Venom with 12 poison 4+ shots and better range.
For 120 I can get 20 poison 4+ shots, a Str 8 AP2 shot that is an ObjSec unit that can deepstrike (as long as we want to talk about forcing the enemy to deploy differently to protect himself).

Yes, i do understand that there are certain things they can do that are slightly unique. The issue for me is - the uniqueness...isn't that exciting. The gap they fill is very specialized and also counts a little bit (in my opinion) on my opponent playing like a narf.

Like, say someone dropped some Mandrakes in my back field. I wouldn't waste time with firing a Wave Serpent at them. Hell, with Eldar or DE I'd probably just move away from them and be able to ignore them.
If I had even one moderate assault unit I'd probably just wipe them out on my turn 1 since they'd easily be within my threat range if they came in within range to fire their weapons.
If I was IG - one squad with a flamer pretty much handles them - hell, assault afterwards if they're still kicking, the Guardsmen will win easy.
If it was Space Marines, the shooting is so minor as to be almost negligible, again a handy flamer if needed handles the issue.
With my Daemons I probably run some Nettes over to eat them for breakfast.
With my Orks - hah! I crush them with something and use the boosted movement to my advantage as I advance up field via boomerang.
Basically, as long as your opponent has flamer tech or an assault unit about as fearsome as...well, any assault uni in the game (honestly, I can't think of an assault unit that would lose to Mandrakes off hand...I can't even think of too many basic Troop selections for that matter)

Now, if my opponent was dumb enough to shoot at the 2+ cover save models...sweet! Yes, if I thought that would happen very often I would run them a lot. The thing is, to my mind, that is counting on my opponent being a bit dense. I don't like to wager on that. As noted, most basic Troop selections are capable of beating up Mandrakes in assault. You have an 18" weapon. What that means is, your decoy unit, at most, is going to absorb a bit of flamer attention, or serve as a boomerang, or tie up the attention of a basic Troop unit that will assault and wipe them out within about 2 turns.

Yeah, they're cheapish...but the gain I get on the tabletop is, as far as I can see, in accordance with their presented value. If they were given an assault grenade effect and even basic armor or the Daemon rule or something (or, dream of dreams, the ability for the Nightfiend to take upgraded melee weapons) I would consider them actually pretty decent, because then they could perform their actual job of coming into my opponent's back field and being a solid threat that can shoot up and assault and kill small to moderate size shooting units.

At the moment, they have moderate shooting ability, and will lose basically all assaults - not making them much of a threat even if shoved into an exciting place. Which, to my mind, means they're not very good at what they're supposed to be good at.

That all said - if they work for you then rock on! I have no issue with people looking to make them work, and if you get them to work consistently I'd love to hear the stories of how it's working so I can learn about it. But my expectation is slim in that regard as I think it requires poor play from one's opponent.

_________________


The Title Troupe! - Nom fellow posters for custom titles.
Back to top Go down
 
Splintermind Episode 4
Back to top 
Page 1 of 2Go to page : 1, 2  Next

Permissions in this forum:You cannot reply to topics in this forum
THE DARK CITY :: 

GENERAL DRUKHARI DISCUSSION

 :: Splintermind
-
Jump to: