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 Proposed Changes to Dark Eldar Codex

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MRC
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PostSubject: Proposed Changes to Dark Eldar Codex   Thu Oct 23 2014, 18:11

I don't think the new codex is as horrible as many have been sayinng it is since it came out. That said, here is my "wishlist" for improving the units to make a more intersting, competive codex:

Universal Army Rules
1 - Replace Night Vision with Incredible Senses special rule (Incredible Senses gives unit Night Vision USR and forces any enemy unit that makes saving throws against shooting/close-combat attacks inflicted by a unit with this rule to re-roll saving throws of 6+)
2 - Combat Drugs changed to a D3 roll, granting either +1S, +1WS, or +1A

ARTEFACTS OF CRUELTY
1 - Animus Vitae -- (No change)
2 - Archangel of Pain -- Changed so that ATSKNF units are affected by it, but Fearless units are still not
3 - Armor of Misery -- Changed to grant a 4+ save, 6++ invul, and -2 Ld for all enemy within 12"
4 - Djin Blade -- Changed to grant 1 + D6 attacks, with a roll of 6 on the D6 causing an automatic wound on user with no saves of any kind.
5 - Helm of Spite -- (No change)
6 - Parasite's Kiss -- Changed to S:1 AP3, 12" range, Poisoned (2+), Soul-leech

HQ
-Archon -- Add "Master of the Kabal" special rule to profile (allows Archon to give a free Webway Portal to D3 friendly DE characters, including himself, before the game begins)
-Succubus -- Dodge save changed to 5++ against shooting and 3++ against close combat attacks
-Haemonculus -- Gain access to all Arcane Wargear options
-Court of the Archon -- Can only be taken if you have an Archon to "unlock" them; Ur-Ghul gains Shred USR for close combat attacks

SPECIAL CHARACTERS
-Lelith -- "A League Apart" allows here to re-roll al to Hits and to Wounds in close combat, not just in challenges; her "Quicksilver Dodge" rule gives her a 4++ against shooting and a 2++ against close combat attacks.
-Urien -- Gains a Webway portal as part of his wargear
-Drazhar -- Gains plasma grenades and has the Soulthirst Warlord Trait automatically

TROOPS
-Kabalite Warriors -- (No change)
-Wyches -- Dodge save changed to a 5++ against shooting and a 3++ against close combat attacks

ELITES
-Truborn -- (No changes)
-Bloodbrides -- Dodge save changed to a 5++ against shooting and a 3++ against close combat attacks; any Bloodbride may upgrade with Wych Weapons
-Incubi -- Gain plasma grenades
-Mandrakes -- Gain Mandrake Blades, which are S: User AP5, Cause ID on 6+ to wound
-Wracks -- Gain Stubborn and Preferred Enemy USRs
-Grotesques -- (No Change)

FAST ATTACK
-Reavers -- Gain Scout USR
-Hellions -- Hellglaives become S:+2 AP4, Rending
-Scourges -- (No Change)
-Beastmaster -- (No Change)
-Razorwing -- Gains Vector Dancer and Missile Lock USRs
-Raider -- Gains "Raider Tactics" special rule (allows the vehicle to turbo-boost 12" and shoot or shoot and still turbo-boost 12"; number of weapons that can be shot at full BS is still dependant on how fast the vehicle moved during the Movement phase).
-Venom -- Gains "Raider Tactics" special rule

HEAVY SUPPORT
-Ravager -- Gains "Raider Tactics" special rule
-Voidraven -- Gains Vector Dancer and Missile Lock USRs
-Talos -- (No change)
-Chronus -- Spirit Probe changed to give +1 to FNP rolls (like before) and also give all friendly DE units within 6" Eternal Warrior.
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barenone
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PostSubject: Re: Proposed Changes to Dark Eldar Codex   Thu Oct 23 2014, 19:11

A lot of what you put would make the army way to broken but some good stuff.
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Thor665
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PostSubject: Re: Proposed Changes to Dark Eldar Codex   Thu Oct 23 2014, 19:15

@MRC wrote:
Universal Army Rules
1 - Replace Night Vision with Incredible Senses special rule (Incredible Senses gives unit Night Vision USR and forces any enemy unit that makes saving throws against shooting/close-combat attacks inflicted by a unit with this rule to re-roll saving throws of 6+
2 - Combat Drugs changed to a D3 roll, granting either +1S, +1WS, or +1A
1. I would oppose this rule as being a bit unfair.
2. This would be nice and quite balanced and also remove the non-fluffy to the army +1 T effect - though Coven is trying to move us away from fragility.

@MRC wrote:
ARTEFACTS OF CRUELTY
1 - Animus Vitae -- (No change)
2 - Archangel of Pain -- Changed so that ATSKNF units are affected by it, but Fearless units are still not
3 - Armor of Misery -- Changed to grant a 4+ save, 6++ invul, and -2 Ld for all enemy within 12"
4 - Djin Blade -- Changed to grant 1 + D6 attacks, with a roll of 6 on the D6 causing an automatic wound on user with no saves of any kind.
5 - Helm of Spite -- (No change)
6 - Parasite's Kiss -- Changed to S:1 AP3, 12" range, Poisoned (2+), Soul-leech
2. A good change! Also, quite fair, and I still don't think it would be particularly competitive even so.
3. Seems okay.
4. That might make it playable.
6. The cleaner rule would probably be 'fleshbane' unless the goal is to avoid having it affect superheavy MCs as much.

@MRC wrote:
HQ
-Archon -- Add "Master of the Kabal" special rule to profile (allows Archon to give a free Webway Portal to D3 friendly DE characters, including himself, before the game begins)
-Succubus -- Dodge save changed to 5++ against shooting and 3++ against close combat attacks
-Haemonculus -- Gain access to all Arcane Wargear options
-Court of the Archon -- Can only be taken if you have an Archon to "unlock" them; Ur-Ghul gains Shred USR for close combat attacks
The Archon thing feels overpowered.
I like the Succubus thing as it is in line with Lelith - maybe a 5++/4++, but I like the idea.
Agree on the Haem.
Like the Court idea.

@MRC wrote:
SPECIAL CHARACTERS
-Lelith -- "A League Apart" allows here to re-roll al to Hits and to Wounds in close combat, not just in challenges; her "Quicksilver Dodge" rule gives her a 4++ against shooting and a 2++ against close combat attacks.
-Urien -- Gains a Webway portal as part of his wargear
-Drazhar -- Gains plasma grenades and has the Soulthirst Warlord Trait automatically
If you did that to Lelith I think she'd need a price adjustment, as otherwise she would become superior to basically any other assault based HQ.
I don't think a WWP is a good call for Urien - because at that point he's a 35 point upgrade from a regular Haem with WWP - and why would you ever not do that?
I think Draz would still be bad, frankly.

@MRC wrote:
TROOPS
-Kabalite Warriors -- (No change)
-Wyches -- Dodge save changed to a 5++ against shooting and a 3++ against close combat attacks
As with the Succubus, I tend to favor the 5++/4++ scheme - I'd also want to adjust wych weapons though. Eh, it's a potential fix for them, at least they'd be more survivable.

@MRC wrote:
ELITES
-Truborn -- (No changes)
-Bloodbrides -- Dodge save changed to a 5++ against shooting and a 3++ against close combat attacks; any Bloodbride may upgrade with Wych Weapons
-Incubi -- Gain plasma grenades
-Mandrakes -- Gain Mandrake Blades, which are S: User AP5, Cause ID on 6+ to wound
-Wracks -- Gain Stubborn and Preferred Enemy USRs
-Grotesques -- (No Change)
I'd still tend to prefer Bloodbrides to be more of a mirror of Trueborn and have multiple weapon upgrade options available, but this at least makes them a theoretical option over regular Wyches.
Incubi would benefit strongly from that change, it would make them worth taking.
I think Mandrakes simply need a regular save of some variety and the ability to take some wargear upgrades to the Sarge. As stands, they are still an unarmored assault unit lacking grenades. This would make them better, but I don't think it's the right sort of better and also don't think it addresses their actual issues much.


@MRC wrote:
FAST ATTACK
-Reavers -- Gain Scout USR
-Hellions -- Hellglaives become S:+2 AP4, Rending
-Scourges -- (No Change)
-Beastmaster -- (No Change)
-Razorwing -- Gains Vector Dancer and Missile Lock USRs
-Raider -- Gains "Raider Tactics" special rule (allows the vehicle to turbo-boost 12" and shoot or shoot and still turbo-boost 12"; number of weapons that can be shot at full BS is still dependant on how fast the vehicle moved during the Movement phase).
-Venom -- Gains "Raider Tactics" special rule
I don't think Reavers need anything.
That would certainly make Hellions competitive...
Beastmasters actually probably need a change.
I don't think Razorwing needs or should get Missile Lock. Vector dancer is good though.
I don't think Raiders need much of anything either, that rule would make us silly fast, but...man, in objective missions, how would anyone ever deal with us?

@MRC wrote:
HEAVY SUPPORT
-Ravager -- Gains "Raider Tactics" special rule
-Voidraven -- Gains Vector Dancer and Missile Lock USRs
-Talos -- (No change)
-Chronus -- Spirit Probe chnaged to give +1 to FNP rolls (like before) and also give all friendly DE units within 6" Eternal Warrior.
Simply giving the Ravager back Aerial Assault would be fine - they would very much be busted with that extra 12" move. That's like hop out in front of LoS blocking building, shoot, hop back over and behind it. It is fearsome movement.
I agree on the Missile Lock for Voidraven. Neutral on Vector Dancer. I still think it would suck even with both.
That would be a potent shift for the Chronus - but not one I disagree with as unbalanced. Still, it's again the survivability aspect. I'd rather see rules that made us more cannons. We're supposed to be the glass cannon, I'm okay being fragile, my hope is to do more damage.

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Unholyllama
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PostSubject: Re: Proposed Changes to Dark Eldar Codex   Thu Oct 23 2014, 19:16

There's a number of changes I can think of but the only one that I think is needed beyond all others is the Wyches drop to 7 or 8 points. As is, they are more expensive than Daemonettes who are better than wyches and the same cost as an Ork that's been upgraded to have a 4+ armor. As is, Wyches are too expensive for what they are in our own codex let alone when compared to other, comparable units in other codices.
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The Strange Dark One
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PostSubject: Re: Proposed Changes to Dark Eldar Codex   Thu Oct 23 2014, 20:02

Funny. I'm not an expert but it was a recurring thought of mine that somebody here should be working on an "inofficial" Dark Eldar Codex. Or some kind of "Codex Patch" .

I'm sure a lot could be achieved by tweaking some existing rules or "adapting" some of units to a power level comparable to other codices. While it surely wouldn't be allowed in tournaments, I could imagine a small sheet of changes being legit when you play with friends (especially if there would be a whole community backing it up).

But I would really only focus on the important and really useless stuff and don't add some extra fancy rules to spice things up. DE aren't known to be op and as such I'm sure some would have no problem letting them have some more options. Just my two cents!
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PostSubject: Re: Proposed Changes to Dark Eldar Codex   Fri Oct 24 2014, 12:10

@MRC wrote:
Universal Army Rules
1 - Replace Night Vision with Incredible Senses special rule (Incredible Senses gives unit Night Vision USR and forces any enemy unit that makes saving throws against shooting/close-combat attacks inflicted by a unit with this rule to re-roll saving throws of 6+)
Too far I think.

@MRC wrote:
2 - Combat Drugs changed to a D3 roll, granting either +1S, +1WS, or +1A
Too.....boring. As is I think the option are too limited. Limiting them further wouldn;t help things.

@MRC wrote:
ARTEFACTS OF CRUELTY
2 - Archangel of Pain -- Changed so that ATSKNF units are affected by it, but Fearless units are still not
I think it would be better saying that ATSKNF and Fearless are both affected but to a reduced level. The obvious suggestion would be "they still get their armour save".

@MRC wrote:
3 - Armor of Misery -- Changed to grant a 4+ save, 6++ invul, and -2 Ld for all enemy within 12"
Double range and no Fear? Doesn't really seem worth it.

@MRC wrote:
HQ
-Archon -- Add "Master of the Kabal" special rule to profile (allows Archon to give a free Webway Portal to D3 friendly DE characters, including himself, before the game begins)
Broken. A free portal in is too powerful an affect to come free with the model.

@MRC wrote:
-Urien -- Gains a Webway portal as part of his wargear
Why? He's doesn;t strike me as the sort of model who really needs one.

@MRC wrote:
-Drazhar -- Gains plasma grenades and has the Soulthirst Warlord Trait automatically
I would argue that Drazhar shouldn;t have a Warlord Trait because there is no way an Incubi, ANY Incubi, should be a Warlord. They're bodyguards, not army leaders.

@MRC wrote:
-Incubi -- Gain plasma grenades
The option to have them maybe. I have felt for a while that the lack of grenades is their little bit of balance considering what they can do in combat.

@MRC wrote:
-Wracks -- Gain Stubborn and Preferred Enemy USRs
Again, I see no real reason for this.

@MRC wrote:
-Reavers -- Gain Scout USR
-Hellions -- Hellglaives become S:+2 AP4, Rending
It makes no sense to give Reavers MORE consdiering they just gained Hit And Run. I would drop this idea for Hellions you offer, and give HELLIONS the Scout special rule.

@MRC wrote:
-Raider -- Gains "Raider Tactics" special rule (allows the vehicle to turbo-boost 12" and shoot or shoot and still turbo-boost 12"; number of weapons that can be shot at full BS is still dependant on how fast the vehicle moved during the Movement phase).
-Venom -- Gains "Raider Tactics" special rule
-Ravager -- Gains "Raider Tactics" special rule
Very broken. Nobody would ever be happy with that unless there was a SERIOUS down side.

@MRC wrote:
-Chronos -- Spirit Probe changed to give +1 to FNP rolls (like before) and also give all friendly DE units within 6" Eternal Warrior.
Eternal Warrior?! I think that might be pushing the abilities of the Chronos a tad too far!
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PostSubject: Re: Proposed Changes to Dark Eldar Codex   Fri Oct 24 2014, 12:58

-Razor wing with vector dancer and/or strafing run.
-Wyches dodge works vs overwatch (invul vs all shooting may prove too OP for their point cost).
-Hellions stunclaw (add rending)
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HokutoAndy
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PostSubject: Re: Proposed Changes to Dark Eldar Codex   Sat Oct 25 2014, 07:03

Give hellions haywire grenades and they have a clear combat role, as well as the cool imagery of skyboard riding punks haywiring a kabal raider to loot them.
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PostSubject: Re: Proposed Changes to Dark Eldar Codex   Sat Oct 25 2014, 13:48

@HokutoAndy wrote:
Give hellions haywire grenades and they have a clear combat role, as well as the cool imagery of skyboard riding punks haywiring a kabal raider to loot them.
I really like this idea. Since the 3rd edition models I think them to be Green Goblins. So giving them a range of grenades to pick from: Plasma for 1 point, Defensive for 2 poinst and Haywire for 3 points. Maybe even give them access to melta bombs for 5 points a pop.
I wouldn't allow to mix and match all grenades though.

In general I feel the suggestions you make are too big of a change. If you want a top tier codex, just stick "Dark" to your Eldar codex and play them as is.


If you want to do something about power level I think you need a ignore cover upgrade for Ravagers and our Flyers. That could really rock things around.

I do like your idea of upgrading Wyches, Bloodbrides and Succubus but I would't go so far as you suggest.
Wyche Dodge: +1 cover vs shooting and 4++ in CC (I prefer cover over invul vs shooting as you can't dodge a flamer et al)
Bloodbrides: +2 cover vs shooting and 4++ in CC. They can take 4 Wych Weapons, no restrictions.
Succubus: +2 cover vs shooting and 3++ in CC. (maybe then she needs a price upgrade because 3++ is really good, even on T3)

Further more I would Suggest Deamon USR on Mandrakes, nothing more.
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The PayneTrayn
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PostSubject: Re: Proposed Changes to Dark Eldar Codex   Sat Oct 25 2014, 15:42

I had a thought for Aether-Sails: Give the equipped model a 2d6" move in the assault phase. Fits the fluff of shooting up a target, then zooming away before they can respond.
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MyNameDidntFit
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PostSubject: Re: Proposed Changes to Dark Eldar Codex   Mon Oct 27 2014, 09:54

I actually laughed out loud reading this. Thanks for brightening a dull Monday, MRC.

However, in seriousness, it reads as brutally OTT wishlisting.

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